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Kansas Football Recruiting 2012: Evaluating The Class

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While most of the class in the books, the expectation at Kansas is that some things are still likely to change or develop as the spring semester roles on. That said, the bulk of the signing day class is in and all things considered there are some positives and some potential concerns to take away.

First off if we're truly evaluating the class and additions as a whole to date, we have to include the 'transfers'. While Dayne Crist, Jake Heaps and Justin McCay don't count toward any recruiting class ranking, they all provide some pretty big value to the program so they have to be included when talking about this class.

With that in mind, Kansas has signed 20. Let's take a look at the components of Charlie Weis's first class.

Star-divide

Quarterback - A

It's hard not to be extremely enthusiastic about this position based on the changes that were made. Dayne Crist will be the frontrunner for the starting job but Kansas has an incoming player who is proven at the junior college level that can compete and provide depth in a back up role.

If Turner Baty isn't needed, then he can redshirt and still have three years to play at the University of Kansas. Two of those years he will compete with incoming transfer Jake Heaps. In a perfect world Charlie Weis has gone out and instantly given himself his starting quarterback for the next four seasons. That's a pretty impressive start to rebuilding the Kansas program.

Obviously that's the ideal and things can change, it doesn't hurt our standing at the position. If Weis can have some success with Crist and further the Weis/QB mystique, that only strengthens his position when recruiting the next high school quarterback addition.


RunningBack - B

Kansas already had some pretty strong options at this position. With Weis's system some of those options might become even more valuable. Yet this is still a position where you can never really have enough depth. Kansas adds a junior to the mix to provide some immediate help as necessary.

Overall this isn't necessarily the biggest area of improvement but it could prove to be pretty valuable depending on how things shake out.


Wide Receiver/Tight End - B

Kansas does have a plethora of wideouts on the roster but many of them are pretty unproven. This wasn't a huge area of concern for this particular class, but Weis did bring in a potentially big junior college prospect as well as a potential program player.

At tight end Kansas did the same thing. One junior college player with a low risk, high reward type ceiling and a high school prospect that can be molded for the longterm Kansas did some good things in providing options and competition at these positions and they did so in a pretty strategic manner.


Offensive Line - C/Incomplete

Kansas has a good crop in the system and while next years class will need to be stepped up in terms of numbers, this one only included a pair of high school players. A big reason for that is that we could still see some movement in terms of transfer market or further JuCo additions and that is really what Kansas could use next year.

As for the immediate needs addressed, the two that Kansas landed have big frames and are exactly the type of offensive lineman that Kansas can shape and mold for three years before turning them into upperclassman starters. I like the two, I consider this group incomplete because we could see more movement.


Defensive Line - A

It's hard to deny that this was a huge are of need. Kansas brought in four players at the position and that is huge from a depth perspective. We'll still need to see it on the field from some of them, but it does sound like a Tavai is going to be a player and at the very least McKinney and Stowers will push for time.

I think you have to give the group an A just because we were so desperate and at least now we can build a rotation instead of running two guys to the point of exhaustion and wearing down in the fourth quarter if not earlier.


Linebacker - B+

Best high school prospect in the class and a project type player. It's nice to see us address every position with such a small class and this one is no exception. We've been in the spot before where we have been razor thin at linebacker and it's no fun. Miles will play sooner rather than later and Arnick could be a solid developmental player. Without Miles this is probably a C, but it wasn't necessarily a huge need. Still it's nice to see some solid talent added.


Defensive Back - C

It's hard to say if Kansas has any immediate impact players at this spot and it is a position with some depth concerns. That said Nas Moore and Greg Allen have excellent potential and Moore falls in that low risk, high reward category. I think Allen gives you a future contributor and Williams a developmental type prospect, but it's hard to say if any are going to step in and change the fortunes of this group right away.

Ideally we get some improvement from what we have on the roster and it's hard to change everything instantly, but the additions on the defensive line might have more impact on any defensive backfield improvement than the additions in the backfield.



Overall

I think you give the staff a pretty solid B on a curve or maybe a B- in this one. Considering the timeline, size of the class and needs for this class, they went out with a different approach than normal and put together competition that can improve the program immediately. At least that's the hope.

Junior College talent and transfers have helped an old man to the West build up a pretty solid program twice now, so I'm not at all above copying that model. Now we just have to make sure that our staff can coach that talent up and find a way to maximize what they have in the same way.

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that’s certainly optimistic

by kcgregory on Feb 1, 2012 1:20 PM CST reply actions  

yeah probably so.

I’m sure in the long run it probably won’t look this rosy, but in the context of coming off a 2-10 season, a coaching change and limited timeline, I just thought they addressed some needs pretty well.

Questions, Comments? email me at denverjhawk@hotmail.com

by Owen on Feb 1, 2012 2:30 PM CST up reply actions  

oh...

and without the transfers factored in, I probably don’t go as high as I did.

Questions, Comments? email me at denverjhawk@hotmail.com

by Owen on Feb 1, 2012 2:31 PM CST up reply actions  

i guess i had tried to wash out of my mind just how much of a trainwreck he’s taking over. in context it’s fine, but he really gets most of the credit due to transfers and limited time to make a recruiting impact. overall, classes like this one will only lead to more trouble for kufball.

by kcgregory on Feb 1, 2012 2:54 PM CST up reply actions  

I don't know that we can really say that.

If these Juco players and transfers can come in and improve the program next year, I think we can build on that.

Questions, Comments? email me at denverjhawk@hotmail.com

by Owen on Feb 1, 2012 2:57 PM CST up reply actions  

On a curve, I'd give an A

Considering the timeline and what little I know, it appears that Coach Weis himself was heavily involved in recruiting start to finish. Considering the many other things he is needed for, that was huge. Give em an A.

by ranron on Feb 1, 2012 1:28 PM CST reply actions  

I agree

Weis still has a lot to prove (in my eyes) that he’s more than just a name, but considering the circumstances, this class at least meets expectations even without bringing in 3 top-teir QB options. Just about ANY school would love to have even 2 of those 3, but Weis and Co. somehow convinced them to come to a school that has been crummy at best for two seasons.

Kila's slash for Apr 20 to May 4, 2011, right before he was sent down: .276 / .344 / .448

by SagehenMacGyver47 on Feb 1, 2012 4:41 PM CST up reply actions  

You can make that 3

seasons on the crapper. The biggest move forward had to be made in the AD office, and I consider Zenger for Perkins a HUGE upgrade, across the board as well as football in particular.

RRROOOOCK CHAAAALLLK! JAAAAYYYHAAAAWWWK! KAAAAYYY UUuuuUU!

by KU62 on Feb 2, 2012 3:54 AM CST up reply actions  

by 3 seasons,

I mean you can include 2009, with Perkins laying the two biggest turds.

2012 prospects separate the optimists from pessimists – we’ll have to find out … it could be the first step on the long road to respectability or even more … it could be just an end run that gets run out of bounds instead of turning the corner.

RRROOOOCK CHAAAALLLK! JAAAAYYYHAAAAWWWK! KAAAAYYY UUuuuUU!

by KU62 on Feb 2, 2012 4:05 AM CST up reply actions  

If RB's are a B

then WR/TE needs to be higher. With McCay and Ford, it would seem like an even greater talent infusion than at QB, and about as long lasting. The TE’s are quite a wild card.

by dagger108 on Feb 1, 2012 8:31 PM CST up reply actions  

Real Quick...

Weis stated during his presser that several needs will be addressed by incoming transfers like Dayne Crist. He can’t comment on them until they have finished at their current schools and enrolled at Kansas but he KNOWS several are coming.

Questions, Comments? email me at denverjhawk@hotmail.com

by Owen on Feb 1, 2012 2:39 PM CST reply actions  

just restressed...

MULTIPLE additions still to be made. Hinting at the 5th year transfers set to fill holes.

Questions, Comments? email me at denverjhawk@hotmail.com

by Owen on Feb 1, 2012 2:48 PM CST up reply actions  

and he will be open to 5th years ever year...

VERY low risk as it doesn’t affect recruiting numbers because they come in and then they head out one year later.

Questions, Comments? email me at denverjhawk@hotmail.com

by Owen on Feb 1, 2012 2:50 PM CST up reply actions  

This is from a notre dame roster website.
For 5th year seniors, Notre Dame has 13 players eligible for 5th years – John Goodman (WR), Deion Walker (WR), Braxston Cave (OL), Lane Clelland (OL), Jake Golic (TE), Sean Cwynar (NT), Kapron Lewis-Moore (DE), Hafis Williams (DL), Brandon Newman (DL), Anthony McDonald (LB), David Posloszny (LB), Dan McCarthy (S), Jamoris Slaughter (S).

by Jonathan Hake on Feb 1, 2012 2:57 PM CST up reply actions   1 recs

Golic for the WIN!

Gotta get some ESPN morning radio love.

The poster formerly known as DCJayhawk0208

by PDXJayhawk on Feb 1, 2012 3:54 PM CST up reply actions  

Wow, what a list!

My guess is that on his recruiting trip to ND to meet with Crist (AKA the reunion tour), he received several verbal commitments and a few possibles. That is really exciting. Instant talent infusion and more virtual coaches helping the others learn the system. The latter is the more crucial factor.

by dagger108 on Feb 1, 2012 8:26 PM CST up reply actions  

Why would they?

The kids have their degree, they’re grown men and if they were contributing and happy they’d probably stay put anyways.

The name of that song played at KC Comets games in the '80's was Giorgio Moroder's "The Chase." Now you know.

by labbadabba on Feb 1, 2012 3:10 PM CST up reply actions  

agreed...

they have to have graduated or else they can’t do it so it’s not like you’re poaching kids who are a detriment to the term student athlete.

Questions, Comments? email me at denverjhawk@hotmail.com

by Owen on Feb 1, 2012 3:16 PM CST up reply actions  

Plus, they're doing it

primarily for academic/grad school reasons

Kila's slash for Apr 20 to May 4, 2011, right before he was sent down: .276 / .344 / .448

by SagehenMacGyver47 on Feb 1, 2012 4:35 PM CST up reply actions  

That is far–fetched

to the point of absurdity. There may be half a dozen departments where KU has better grad programs than ND. Once upon a time, the epithet “Harvard on the Kaw” seemed almost appropriate but the legislature dropped out of the competition and alums have not picked up much of the slack. We are closer to ND on the Hill athletically than academically, with or without a few more of their graduates.

RRROOOOCK CHAAAALLLK! JAAAAYYYHAAAAWWWK! KAAAAYYY UUuuuUU!

by KU62 on Feb 2, 2012 4:22 AM CST up reply actions  

The gray box means sarcasm, just an fyi.

You’re exactly right. I just wonder if the NCAA sees more coaches going this route if they’ll tighten it up.

Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
Rock Chalk Talk

by Warden11 on Feb 2, 2012 7:14 AM CST up reply actions  

but again...

my point is that even if these guys aren’t doing it solely for academic reasons, why not allow them the opportunity. They have given four years to a program, graduated from school and they’ve done the student athlete.

I guess I see this as one of the few times that a player can really be on the advantageous side of things. Gives them another year of grad school, and one last opportunity to make a run at the league.

Questions, Comments? email me at denverjhawk@hotmail.com

by Owen on Feb 2, 2012 7:31 AM CST up reply actions  

Personally, I've got no issue with it.

However, these guys are also eligible at their school that has paid for them the last few years. Just seems like the NCAA will not like the idea of coaches “recruiting” players from other programs that are eligible to go.

Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
Rock Chalk Talk

by Warden11 on Feb 2, 2012 10:17 AM CST up reply actions  

I guess that's where the line should maybe be drawn...

Crist can’t play anymore at Notre Dame, he can use that one year at Kansas though. At least that was my understanding on the deal.

Questions, Comments? email me at denverjhawk@hotmail.com

by Owen on Feb 2, 2012 10:28 AM CST up reply actions  

He's played four years there.

2008, 2009, 2010 and 2011. You can’t play five years at the same school unless you take a redshirt. Crist never took a redshirt, Notre Dame doesn’t really use redshirts.

Questions, Comments? email me at denverjhawk@hotmail.com

by Owen on Feb 2, 2012 11:06 AM CST up reply actions  

really?

so you could technically play five seasons if you enroll in grad school?

Questions, Comments? email me at denverjhawk@hotmail.com

by Owen on Feb 2, 2012 12:20 PM CST up reply actions  

That's the way I've read everything that talks about Crist.

I might be wrong on this one, are you sure he hasn’t snuck in a redshirt somewhere along the way? He’s had 2 surgeries and I don’t think he stepped on the field his freshman year. His stat page at ESPN only shows 3 years worth of stats.

Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
Rock Chalk Talk

by Warden11 on Feb 2, 2012 12:32 PM CST up reply actions  

I think Notre Dame is a tricky example...

because my understanding with ND is that they basically don’t allow redshirting and that if you are there four years you can ask to spend a fifth with the program or some deal like that but they are pretty selective in those instances.

Let me look at the Russell Wilson example

Questions, Comments? email me at denverjhawk@hotmail.com

by Owen on Feb 2, 2012 1:41 PM CST up reply actions  

Looking at Wilson I think you might be right

He played three at NC State and transferred to Wisky year four.

I guess my new argument would be that if you’re program is crap and a guy wants out or a guy knows he’s not going to play again, then that’s their prerogative and it again gives the athlete the upper hand in what is a few and far between instance in college sports.

Said athlete can go try to contribute to a winner like Wilson, or in Crist’s case you can go where you believe you’ll have one more chance to show what you can do and maybe get to the next level. Crist knew he wasn’t going to play, not sure entirely on Wilson’s story but I’m guessing he was in the same boat or maybe he just wanted to give it a go on a team that could make a run.

I guess I can’t see this ever getting WAY out of hand but you never know.

Questions, Comments? email me at denverjhawk@hotmail.com

by Owen on Feb 2, 2012 1:55 PM CST up reply actions  

If Weis takes on 10 guys that fit this mold, that's pretty close.

I don’t really care either way but I can see the other side of it.

Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
Rock Chalk Talk

by Warden11 on Feb 2, 2012 2:06 PM CST up reply actions  

Great story about the strength coach...

said Holsopple walked into his office last night around 9pm and said he was mad because he didn’t have anyone on the Saturday run list yet. Called him miserable by nature.

Academic support report was very positive. A few guys had a little extra training but in general everything looks positive in the early going.

Questions, Comments? email me at denverjhawk@hotmail.com

by Owen on Feb 1, 2012 2:56 PM CST reply actions  

obviously...

the miserable thing was a little bit in jest.

Questions, Comments? email me at denverjhawk@hotmail.com

by Owen on Feb 1, 2012 2:56 PM CST up reply actions  

Little bit different interpretation from LJW?

“Weis completed the press conference by complimenting his current players, saying, “Early returns out of the weight room have almost been too positive as of right now.” He even mentioned that KU strength and conditioning coordinator Scott Holsopple was upset Wednesday morning because no one had screwed up enough to get put on the Saturday morning run list as punishment."

Wponder what the chance is any player runs just b/c it is good conditioning?

by dagger108 on Feb 1, 2012 9:17 PM CST up reply actions  

No, same interpretation.

Unless I’m missing something.

Questions, Comments? email me at denverjhawk@hotmail.com

by Owen on Feb 1, 2012 10:11 PM CST up reply actions  

I obviously have no idea...

How any of these recruits will pan out. Or even how this coaching staff will pan out. But this is BY FAR the most excited I’ve been about the football program since 2009. And I can’t imagine there are many who would disagree.

by hiphopopotamus on Feb 1, 2012 2:57 PM CST reply actions  

If that's the cutoff, there's no question.
since 2009

Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
Rock Chalk Talk

by Warden11 on Feb 1, 2012 3:10 PM CST up reply actions  

Right

It’s not exactly a high bar to clear, but still feels good to be well above it…

by hiphopopotamus on Feb 1, 2012 3:22 PM CST up reply actions  

I'm excited

but I temper that with the realization that Coach Weis is rebuilding a program essentially from scratch. Actually, from scratch would probalby be better than the historically bad we were under Gill.

"No time for questions. No time for games. Start kickin' ass and takin' down the names." - Dave Mustaine.

by Rivethead on Feb 1, 2012 4:30 PM CST up reply actions  

from scratch?

We don’t have a good group of young players that are just under-coached?

It seems to me that we are even a good QB away from 3 – 4 more W’s last year, which is possibly bowl eligible.

by dagger108 on Feb 1, 2012 8:51 PM CST up reply actions  

Last year?

3-4 more w’s? I thought you’d gotten off the TG kool-aid. The team was very bad all over the field, one qb wasn’t changing that at all last season.

Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
Rock Chalk Talk

by Warden11 on Feb 2, 2012 7:15 AM CST up reply actions  

The more Weis talks about what he found here

The more I’m convinced he started from scratch

by jayhawk1996 on Feb 2, 2012 9:32 AM CST up reply actions  

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