A Big 12 With Ten Teams and a Big 10 With Twelve?
by Owen on Jun 14, 2010 9:00 AM CDT
in Rock Chalk Talk Randomness
Email
PrintWith the addition of the Huskers the Big 10+1 has now bumped to twelve. This means they sit a full two integers above their namesake. With the departure of Nebraska and Colorado the Big 12 has now dropped to ten and all appeared lost in terms of salvaging anything longterm for the conference.
Well, that appears to have potentially changed. Top to bottom, from Chip Brown to KUSports to ESPN and the Kansas City Star, momentum seems to be picking up for the Big 12 continuing on as a ten team conference.
With all the doomsday scenario's that Kansas, Kansas State, Missouri, Baylor and Iowa State have faced over the last week this would certainly seem like a fairly positive outcome when all is said and done. The reports are indicating that the conference on life support a week ago has been brought back to life by a new television deal which will bring the revenue sharing to a much higher level as well as provide Texas the opportunity to have it's own network if they so choose.
Here's the question. With all the talk about A&M to the SEC and the excitement that ensued following the reported meeting between the Pac 10 and Kansas, is this the best option? Do you want the Big 12 to remain viable? It's certainly better than going to the Mountain West, but how committed is Missouri at this point and is Texas A&M prepared to stand down and let the Longhorns once again run the show?
If the Big 12 survives it will be in the context of a dysfunctional family. A week ago it was a free for all to get out while the getting was good and let the leftovers fend for themselves. Now we're expected to believe that the Texas and Oklahoma schools once ready to bolt are committed to the well being of us lowly Big 12 North schools? It's been a long road and there will likely be more turns, I'm just not sold on the most recent possibility even though it might present the safest scenario for Kansas in the short term.
UPDATE: ESPN Reporting that Texas to the Pac 10 is imminent and the last ditch attempt by Dan Beebe has "zero" chance at succeeding. Tough to know who to believe in this thing.
UPDATE 2: And the Big 12 being saved train continues to pick up steam.
FINAL UPDATE: Could be. Texas and Texas A&M have both confirmed that they will remain in the Big 12. One would assume this would solidify the rest. Now the question as to how long this solidifies the conference and if 10 is the magic number or if they might target more for expansion.
Regardless, this would certainly seem to indicate that Kansas still has a home.
246 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
we need to get out...
Sorry as much as I loved the Big 12 and playing all these teams, I don’t wanna go through this again in 3-5 years when everyone is mad at each other again. I don’t trust Mizzou really wants to stay in the Big 12 and everyone know Texas is out for themselves. If we get the chance, get out now. I feel bad about leaving KState and Iowa State, but its just that time. I just don’t see the Big 12 working after how easy it was to tear it up. I guess I’m just bitter about a lot of this.
what was that Texas quote...
We didn’t start this, but we’re prepared to end it. Wasn’t it something along those lines? We that needs to be us. We damn sure didn’t start it, but we need to make sure we do what’s best for the university and I don’t think that’s the Big 12.
by hawkinwihita on Jun 14, 2010 9:19 AM CDT up reply actions
We don't have that option....
If Texas goes, we’ll follow. If Texas stays, we have to stay too.
by hiphopopotamus on Jun 14, 2010 9:24 AM CDT up reply actions
maybe...
If we get an invite to the Pac 10 still and we decide we want to go (yes we look like the bad guy), Texas follows us. And honestly I can still see the Pac 10 inviting us because of that. With the Big 12 taking a hit of 3 teams plus the chance of Mizzou being on the fence and A&M wanting the SEC, Texas won’t hang around. So yes with the damage that’s been done, if we get an invite, we could finish it.
by hawkinwihita on Jun 14, 2010 9:30 AM CDT up reply actions
I think that's a HUUUUGE if ....
Pretty tough for me to believe that the PAC 10 would extend an invite our way if we’re only their 12th. I think that invite we all heard so much is about is contingent on a 16 team league where they can have a PAC East & West. If Texas isn’t going, neither are we.
by hiphopopotamus on Jun 14, 2010 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions
One point that isn't talked about much is a $10M buyout.
Each school currently gets about $2M for allowing NU & CU to leave.
It could be beneficial to hang around for another year or so just to get the $. As long as TU remains a ND wannabe (united when convenient & independent when beneficial), their conference (SWC, BigXII, …) won’t be stable.
Good point but...
I just don’t want us to be on the outside looking in again. Remember there hasn’t been much talk about KU in all this expansion talk til recent. So when the big dogs come knocking, we need to answer. I don’t want KU to turn into a mid major.
by hawkinwihita on Jun 14, 2010 9:46 AM CDT up reply actions
The only way I'm cool with the Big XII
is if we bring in some of the MWC teams and bump the Big XII to a 16-team power conference.
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
Adding a bunch of MWC teams
could give the conference 16 teams, but does it really make it a power conference?
Love the mountains, and the schools there have shown they can play good FB & BB, but they don’t have the fan support that generates the same kind of $.
A ten-team conference in this day and age isn't viable and appears weak
We could pick up Boise St, Utah, TCU, and maybe a Houston and be better off because of it.
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
Better? Okay
but not a power conference. We’d have as much power as the other non-Texas teams in the BigXII.
agreed
which is why I voted to let the whole Big XII thing to go “poof”
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
adding TCU and Houston to the Big 12...
makes recruiting Texas more difficult for Kansas football and give even more power to a state that doesn’t need it.
53 Conference Championships!! and now 6 IN A ROW!!! Holy Hell...Good Luck with That!!
Memphis and Louisville!
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
People ask me what I do in winter when there’s no baseball...Rock Chalk Talk
by Warden11 on Jun 14, 2010 10:27 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
That'd be awesome
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
by mstreeter06 on Jun 14, 2010 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, I really like this.
Now that Cal is gone from Memphis, I don’t mind them. I actually kinda like them a little. And adding another traditional basketball “powerhouse”-ish would be awesome.
what, with the loss of Nebraska and all...
"Not to be cliché or anything, but I’m Jayhawk born and Jayhawk bred and when I die I’ll be Jayhawk dead." - Ovechwin
by Andy Edwards on Jun 14, 2010 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions
How?
Neither one of those schools has a football program worth a damn.
Again, this all about football revenue.
There simply is no substitute for experience.
Yes, but ...
While football revenue might be driving this realignment, there will be an eventual realignment out there that involves all of the basketball schools that’ve been left out in the cold after their conferences have been raided by the Big Tens and Pac-10s and SECs.
Schools like UNC, Duke, Mephis, Syracuse, Georgetown, Kentucky, etc. are all traditional basketball powerhouses who are, like Kansas, being left out of talk about realignments. They’re going to have to go somewhere, too. So, while the Big Sixteen, Pac-16 and SEC might be football superconferences, there’ll eventually have to be a few homes for basketball schools, too.
But why not join a Football Conference
and reap the $$ rewards?
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
That was my thought as well
We just lost a football tradition, 2 even if you ignore Colorado’s last 8 years. This conference, if it remains, just took a MAJOR hit on Saturdays.
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
Agree 100%
I like tx and TCU is a neat little private school with a nice field but we have too many tx schools already
So Chip Brown just reports that we're staying a conference, and ESPN reports that UT & the rest are gone to the P10?
This is so confusing.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
The tricky thing with Chip Brown...
is that it’s widely believed that he’s basically acting as a puppet for UT. So while he is providing a lot of information, it’s tough to say what the motive for the info is.
53 Conference Championships!! and now 6 IN A ROW!!! Holy Hell...Good Luck with That!!
yep.
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
People ask me what I do in winter when there’s no baseball...Rock Chalk Talk
by Warden11 on Jun 14, 2010 10:20 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
The Power of an Idea
So, throughout all of this… I think the power of the ‘meme’ has been placed under a microscope.
Everybody and their grandmother has Tweeted, blogged, heard from ‘sources,’ about a possible outcome to all this realignment. From what I’ve seen, once an idea has been stated, it has taken off and grabbed its fifteen minutes of fame until another idea has come about.
So, when Chip Brown and a number of local talking heads have jumped on the ’Big 12 (10) staying together idea… is it really too surprising that ESPN is citing four anonymous sources that the PAC 10 will expand further?
Think about it from the money perspective… ESPN’s money. They have campuses in California and Connecticut. I think they’d benefit significantly from huge power conferences in terms of television and marketing deals… as compared to smaller fractioned conferences.
Maybe it’s just me, but I think ESPN is trying to extend the PAC 16 meme and make it sound (so it therefore is) inevitable.
http://theacereport.com
-Authentic Sports Journalism-
From what i've seen....
Chip Brown is being fed info from Texas helping push their agenda. First, they made NU look bad. Now they are doing the same with A&M. When the Big 12 goes tits up, they can say, “well, we tried. Blame them.” To me, this is the only explanation of why there are SOOOO many different stories out there. Question is, who i going to bail first, A&M or Texas and company. Just my opinion….
bingo...
just posted a similar deal above. Chip Brown is definitely getting inside info, but it sure appears to have some different motives behind it.
53 Conference Championships!! and now 6 IN A ROW!!! Holy Hell...Good Luck with That!!
one of those motives also seems to include
Orangebloods membership.
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
People ask me what I do in winter when there’s no baseball...Rock Chalk Talk
by Warden11 on Jun 14, 2010 10:23 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
I don't know if I can take another day...
wait a bit…
yep, I’m good. Moar rumorz plz!
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
by labbadabba on Jun 14, 2010 10:29 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Here's How it Could Work
1. The new deal with Fox makes the revenue for staying around in the same ballpark as leaving for the Pac or the SEC. To do this, maybe we end up with a “game of the week” on the Fox network, not just the regional Fox Sports. If the money is similar, the reduced travel costs and the opportunity for UT to build the Longhorn Network could make this the best financial move for Texas (and the rest of the South).
2. Look to expand, but be choosy. Ten teams let’s us play a round robin in football and a double round robin in hoops, which is great. But if you really want that football championship money, then expansion could be possible. Ideal scenario: Texas agrees to take a .75 share of current tv revenues (for now) with the understanding that they’ll make it up with their own channel, AND Fox will offer knowhow/connections/etc. to help get that channel going. We then offer Arkansas a Godfather deal of 1.25 shares in cash. The revenue shift would have no effect on the “1 school, 1 vote” aspect of the bylaws. Then we add Memphis to get the FedEx cash.
This conference would end up with more money and exposure from it’s base tv deal (something like at least $5MM more per school). It would have a $10MM sponsor ready to sign on the dotted line. It would also have the $20MM in fines from NU and CU.
Perhaps most importantly, it offers Texas the best possible opportunity to get their own Network going.
3. Security. The biggest concern people have right now is whether any plains states/Texas conference is sustainable in the long run. To help with this, we create a “leaving penalty” with some real teeth- something like 20% of your tv revenues for the next 10 years. In exchange for such a tough clause, we create a “get out of jail free” clause for when our current tv deals end. At that point, any school that wants to walk away could with no penalty. In effect, this would buy the conference enough time to fairly evaluate it and see if it’s sustainable. If it isn’t, we all walk away not too much worse for wear.
You can never have too much talent.
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Jun 14, 2010 10:51 AM CDT via mobile reply actions 2 recs
I don't like this new TV deal
It’s like putting a really nice bandaid on a fractured leg. The money will be nice, but it only makes things worse with Texas being the kingpin in the conference. By allowing them to have their own network, while not allowing a Big 12 network, gives them more power which is one of the main principles the Big 12 is disbanding in the first place. The money will just sweep the issues under the rug for a few years.
I also think giving a school (like Arkansas) special treatment is also a bad thing. It continues to send the message that the Big 12 and Dan Beebe will continue to give special treatment to certain schools. This conference is being torn apart by the mistreatment of the members from an equality standpoint. I would love a school like Arkansas to join the conference, just not under those circumstances.
Surgeon General's Warning: K-State-Mizzou basketball may increase the risk of high blood pressure. Please consult your doctor prior to watching any of these games.
Agree
It is time to put the Big XII out of it’s misery. By continuing the league, we just end up giving Texas more power, and prolong the demise. The only I would be in favor prolonging the demise of the Big XII was to give the final 10 teams a chance to find a new BCS conference before disbanding.
R.I.P. Derrick Thomas. The Chiefs and the World have never been the same since your untimely death.
by ChiefsFan90s on Jun 14, 2010 11:21 AM CDT up reply actions
Except
Special treatment isn’t really killing this conference, IMO. It provides a nice excuse for schools looking to bolt, but it’s really about the money. If tv revenues had been split equally last year (instead of the weighted system we have now), the lowest paid schools might have gotten $1.5MM extra. Not chump change, but it pales in comparison to the extra $13MM or so that NU gets by jumping to the Big Whatever.
Other than that, what do people have to really complain about? KC losing the offices to Dallas? As a kid that grew up in KC, losing things is what we do. We lost the A’s, the Scouts, the Kings, the NCAA, Albert Pujols/Carlos Beltran/Jermain Dye/Johnny Damon,, and in a few years, possibly Sprint, as well.
You can never have too much talent.
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Jun 14, 2010 12:00 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
sorta -
he went to HS in KC but the Royals didn’t have a clue at the time…
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
I don't think the Royals have a clue ever
Beadlemaniacs - Award winning* college basketball blog (new and improved!)
College Hockey!
agreed
Think of it if we’re Texas- who wants to completely subsidize the smallest programs (Baylor, Iowa State, etc.) while you do all the work?
But… there’s also the argument about being a conference- you support each other for the greater good. It’s a tricky situation.
by mikedrawjayhawk on Jun 14, 2010 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions
From the Journal World
10:18 a.m. Update:
The Orange County Register has learned that Pac-10 officials will meet with KU tonight at an undisclosed location.
The meeting comes as no surprise in the wake of Sunday’s rumors that Pac-10 commissioner Larry Scott was en route to Kansas City. His plane never landed at KCI, but that doesn’t mean he didn’t get to the area somehow, somewhere.
Sources told me late Sunday night that KU’s meeting with the Pac-10 was going down but that it was a back-up plan for KU, as it was looking more and more like the Big 12 may stay together.
It's not that I'm lazy; it's that I just don't care.
It’s also possible that KU is still a backup plan for the Pac10 who is waiting on A&M.
53 Conference Championships!! and now 6 IN A ROW!!! Holy Hell...Good Luck with That!!
If the Big 12 were to stay together.
Would prefer we add two more teams in the process. Maybe Memphis with the offer FedEx has given to every BCS conference, TCU, or even make a huge splash with Boise State. Yes, that would be far in distance, and unlikely but if we were to survive and add two, my preferences would be BSU and Memphis because of money they would be able to bring in.
R.I.P. Derrick Thomas. The Chiefs and the World have never been the same since your untimely death.
by ChiefsFan90s on Jun 14, 2010 11:02 AM CDT up reply actions
So Denver, now that you are heading up RockChalk and KC
Is this your full-time job, or do you still have one of those as well?
It's not that I'm lazy; it's that I just don't care.
Well, Joel Thorman is actually heading up SB Nation Kansas City...
he runs Arrowhead Pride as well and I believe he’s now full time SB Nation.
As for me, not the case…I’ve still got my day job.
53 Conference Championships!! and now 6 IN A ROW!!! Holy Hell...Good Luck with That!!
Is it possible to make a career doing what you're doing?
if so, that’d be freaking sweet!
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
there are certainly those...
within the SB Nation community that are doing so.
53 Conference Championships!! and now 6 IN A ROW!!! Holy Hell...Good Luck with That!!
Good to hear
I know this site will keep expanding based on all of the great information I get here
It's not that I'm lazy; it's that I just don't care.
Texas is staying now
according to Chip Brown…?
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
People ask me what I do in winter when there’s no baseball...Rock Chalk Talk
Texas
is just leveraging their own network so it’s established. Two, three, four years down the line when the rest of the realignment happens and Texas leaves… they’ll be able to hold on to their own network and develop revenue out west.
This thing has shown it’s vulnerable. The Band-Aid metaphor is spot on… Except that this wound won’t heal.
"President Bartlet: A long flight across the night. You know why late flights are good? Because we cease to be earthbound and burdened with practicality. Asking important questions. Talking about the idea that nobody has thought about yet. Put it a different way...
Sam Seaborn: Be poets."
-The West Wing, Season Two, 'The Portland Trip'
East Coast turned Midwest
It's internal bleeding
There is nothing anyone can do to stop the slow; painful death. Not even life support can save this conference
R.I.P. Derrick Thomas. The Chiefs and the World have never been the same since your untimely death.
by ChiefsFan90s on Jun 14, 2010 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions
The Big East survived after its internal fighting about ACC offers (and now Big Ten offers).
I think the Big XII can also survive. Neither will ever be one of the strongest conferences (Mizzou or Texas/Pitt or Rutgers wandering eyes).
by Texas Wahoo on Jun 14, 2010 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions
Probably true but in a few more years,
the direction may be clearer on where everything is heading. Right now everyone is moving along at 100 mph without knowing what’s coming around the corner.
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
People ask me what I do in winter when there’s no baseball...Rock Chalk Talk
Honestly I just want A&M to the SEC if the PAC10 would take us over CU
With the south teams and us to the PAC10, I would worry a lot less about the future….
It's not that I'm lazy; it's that I just don't care.
I meant us over Utah....
Still early and only halfway through my first pot.
It's not that I'm lazy; it's that I just don't care.
I'd agree with that.
But we’re all acting like the new Pacific conference is a great option…it might be if the Big 12 folds completely. However there are a lot of negatives associated with a move to this new conference.
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
People ask me what I do in winter when there’s no baseball...Rock Chalk Talk
yep.
I almost think that the South teams leaving us behind and us forming a new Big XII with the MWC on our own terms would make for a more cohesive conference.
we could even relocate the Big XII headquarters to KC.
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
Don't Forget
That a 16 team conference was tried before, and it turned out to be a disaster. Really, at best it’s basically 2 Big 8s that have to have their winners play eachother before one gets to the BCS.
As long as we can stay viable as a collective for a couple more years, I think there’s real value in not being the “lab rats” in this experiment.
You can never have too much talent.
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Jun 14, 2010 12:07 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Some reports
(and I know, that phrase is used way too often lately) have the Pac-whatever pushing to get the Big XII‘s BCS bid if it dies, so the champion of each half would get a bid. No idea if it’s truly in the minds of the league execs or if it has a chance of happening, though.
In the immortal words of the pin I got while an undergrad: Roses are red, violets are blue...f*** $C.
Where was Beebe on this a while ago?
We are just NOW hearing about a 17-20 million dollar TV contract for the remaining teams, etc etc etc. Where was all this a month ago? A year ago?? Etc.
Beebe’s lack of being proactive vs. reactive in this whole thing is startling.
I wonder if the teams jumping is a done deal pretty much and this effort is just an attempt of Beebe to save face and say “well we did all we could and offered them a contract and they still left.”
I also feel that TAMU wants the SEC no matter what. They’ve wanted to be in the SEC ever since they joined the Big 12.
I also think this is a very temporary move at best. If we stay together now, we will just go through this again in 5 years when the Big 10 and SEC go to 16 teams and there is another scramble for a Western Super conference
Shit happens when you win championships
Beebe's whole defense
the first run around was the renegotiated contract. Problem is, the other conferences renegotiate sooner than the B12 does. Also, with Nebraska and Colorado, that 17-20 gets knocked down a little for everyone to have their own share, not to mention the fact that the schools with the most draw (Texas, Neb, A&M) get the largest share of money.
It’s not that it hasn’t been tried, it’s just that the pie to be divided has gotten smaller, and he may have had more time to get assurances from networks.
by mikedrawjayhawk on Jun 14, 2010 11:45 AM CDT up reply actions
Does this new TV contract
have anything to do with the fact that two teams have officially left the conference? Would that void, or at least open up the discussions for a new deal since they left?
Surgeon General's Warning: K-State-Mizzou basketball may increase the risk of high blood pressure. Please consult your doctor prior to watching any of these games.
It might
Also Beebe would take the money that Colorado and Nebraskie would have to pay in Penalty fees for leaving the league and split that up amongst the remaining schools as well.
Shit happens when you win championships
by Andrew Clark on Jun 14, 2010 11:47 AM CDT up reply actions
yes, that is also included
Problem is, they’re negotiating in 2 years for that new contract, rumored to be what the SEC gets now . Who’s to say the SEC doesn’t add another $5mil per team by then?
On one hand, the B12 doesn’t have the position of having to make the first negotiation offer (by taking what the SEC and B10 have already as a starting point). On the other, they have to wait while the others cash in early.
by mikedrawjayhawk on Jun 14, 2010 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions
Breaking news per ESPN
4 reports indicate that Texas, Texas Tech, Oklahomie and Okie Light’s move to the Pac 10 is imminent.
Chipper Brown still reporting Texas is committed to speaking with the other 9 schools about keeping the school together. Still think this is a move to make Texas look less bad when they jump.
ESPN also apparently hates KU because they continue to involve us in ANY Pac 10 speculation despite the fact that the Pac 10 commish is in Kansas right now.
Shit happens when you win championships
are we sure now?
that Larry Scott is in KC?
Also, Chip Brown saying that Texas is committed doesn’t rule out 1) A&M leaving for the SEC, and 2) further negotiations within the B12 or with the PAC 10
by mikedrawjayhawk on Jun 14, 2010 11:47 AM CDT up reply actions
Well if he isn't yet he will be soon
He is supposively meeting with KU sometime tonight from what I heard. And the weather is calm now so his plane can leave and a flight from Oklahoma/Texas to Kansas doesn’t take more than an hour or a little more (trust me I painfully know haha).
Shit happens when you win championships
by Andrew Clark on Jun 14, 2010 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions
This just after an hour after
SportsCenter lead with the statement:
“Texas to stay in the Big XII…Go Figure.”
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
I think
there should be a ‘not’ in there somewhere
by Walshdollar on Jun 14, 2010 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions
Yeah they will NOT involve us in speculation talk
Which is stupid. Do some basic freaking journalism. If the LJ World knows the Pac 10 commish’s plane is coming you’d think ESPN could figure it out.
ESPN shows scenarios and says “this will be the 15 teams.” WTF, yeah they’ll have a 15 team league alright.
Shit happens when you win championships
by Andrew Clark on Jun 14, 2010 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions
Yeah
Joe Schead still thinks Utah would get the invite of KU. Yeah right.
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
by mstreeter06 on Jun 14, 2010 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions
Definitely
Does Schead really think Utah would still be waiting if they got an offer from the Pac 10. Utah only gets the offer if the conference is going to end up the Pac 12. If the conference ends up the Pac 16, it will be TU, TTU, OSU, OU, and KU.
R.I.P. Derrick Thomas. The Chiefs and the World have never been the same since your untimely death.
by ChiefsFan90s on Jun 14, 2010 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Totally agree
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
by mstreeter06 on Jun 14, 2010 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions
Don't be so confident KU would be in.
I would love it – see my username. However, I’ve been around the Pac for a couple of decades. While KU’s hoops program is amazing, this isn’t really about basketball. Utah and KU both are rated relatively equally academically. Utah’s had a better record of strong football teams recently compared to KU. Utah’s also a heck of a lot closer to all of the current members of the Pac-11. Prior to this “Big 12 South to the Pac” thing blowing up not long ago, Pac expansion talk was all about Colorado and one more, and that 12th team was often seen to be Utah (although some of us on bruinsnation.com want Colorado St. instead, to keep our geographical-pair concept in place if we stay at twelve teams).
Again, I’d be thrilled for KU to be a part of the Pac. However, I’m not going to get too caught up about it until Lew or the Chancellor or the Regents or whoever sign to make it official.
In the immortal words of the pin I got while an undergrad: Roses are red, violets are blue...f*** $C.
The Pac 10 will take KU
See the commish in Kansas right now.
Also travel doesn’t matter. KU makes more sense travel wise because we are close to the Oklahoma Schools and not that far from the Texas Schools.
Then the Pac 10 can go to 8 and 8 divisions with the Big 12 South Schools, KU, CU Arizona and Arizona State in the East and UCLA, USC, Stanford, Cal, Oregon, Oregon State, Warshington and Warshington State in the West.
Makes too much sense
Shit happens when you win championships
by Andrew Clark on Jun 14, 2010 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions
again, I ask
where’s the confirmation that the PAC is in KS right now? Flight tracker still has him in Austin (which would make sense if TX is still waiting). Haven’t seen it in any media reports since last night
by mikedrawjayhawk on Jun 14, 2010 12:18 PM CDT up reply actions
Well if he isn't here now he will be soon
Guess its only 12:30 but he reportedly has a meeting with KU sometime tonight
Shit happens when you win championships
by Andrew Clark on Jun 14, 2010 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions
...
RT @crimsonandblu Local radio in KC reports Pac10’s Larry Scott meeting tonight with Kansas in undisclosed place. #kubball #jayhawks #big12 #ulcers
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
by mstreeter06 on Jun 14, 2010 12:23 PM CDT up reply actions
I love the undisclosed place aspect
Makes me think they are meeting in some underground lair or out in boon frick nowhere in a barn
Shit happens when you win championships
by Andrew Clark on Jun 14, 2010 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions
boon frick nowhere in a barn...
you mean K-State?
by P. J. Karasek on Jun 14, 2010 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Haha awesome
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
by mstreeter06 on Jun 14, 2010 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions
It’s actually at that old church that’s supposed to be a gateway to hell. You know, the one the Pope won’t fly over?
Why? Because this is a deal with the Devil.
You can never have too much talent.
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Jun 14, 2010 1:06 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
No
The one in Stull, KS
I, as many Kansas Jayhawks, made the trip out to Stull several times.
Spooky place.
There simply is no substitute for experience.
Ah -
I had no idea. Looks like the church was torn down in ’02.
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
I believe the "Stairway to Hell"
is still there, just fenced off.
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
People ask me what I do in winter when there’s no baseball...Rock Chalk Talk
How in the world did I not hear about this?
was this a Frat thing?
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
Not that I know of.
Big freshman year thing, though maybe the legend runs through the frats or something.
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
People ask me what I do in winter when there’s no baseball...Rock Chalk Talk
Where is stull kansas?
Sorry I’m originally from Illinois, still not great with KS geography
Shit happens when you win championships
by Andrew Clark on Jun 14, 2010 1:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Straight west of Lawrence a few miles.
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
People ask me what I do in winter when there’s no baseball...Rock Chalk Talk
It's like 10 miles west of Lawrence, in the middle of a po-dunk town.
Some urban legends have tied the cemetery with being one of the gateways to hell. It’s worth a trip, kinda neat.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
gateway to hell
“the pope’s plane wouldn’t fly over it when he was in the U.S.”
haha heard so many legends about that place
by I need more Esteban on Jun 14, 2010 2:08 PM CDT up reply actions
Reports had said
he’d be here last night, but it didn’t happen – whether or not weather was the reason, I don’t know.
In the immortal words of the pin I got while an undergrad: Roses are red, violets are blue...f*** $C.
The commish
has been in Utah as well, so that argument’s out. (Also, he’s not yet here, but apparently will be tonight.)
http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/spt/stories/061410dnspocarltoncol.1d4ad89.html
The Pac-10 has always had ‘travel partners’ for basketball and many of the Olympic sports – UCLA and u$c will go to Arizona, on Thursday one plays ASU and one plays the U of A, then Saturday they trade. That could perhaps continue with an A&M-less Pac-16, though UT and Texas Tech are pretty far apart. I guess in this case it’s a wash as Colorado is basically equidistant from KU and Utah. I just don’t think KU to the Pac is anything near a done deal…even assuming the other Big XII schools join.
In the immortal words of the pin I got while an undergrad: Roses are red, violets are blue...f*** $C.
the stop in Salt Lake City...
Just to let you know, the plane stopped on Friday on the way from the East Coast. The plane was on ground for 30 minutes. And it didn’t stop there on the way to OKC like that story says. They went from Salt Lake City to Oregon, Oregon to California, California to OKC. So take it as you will on that.
by hawkinwihita on Jun 14, 2010 2:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Either way,
if Texas and the rest are staying put, the odds of KU joining the Pac-whatever are extremely minimal, at best.
In the immortal words of the pin I got while an undergrad: Roses are red, violets are blue...f*** $C.
Larry Scott
was supposed to come to Kansas last night
http://www2.registerguard.com/cms/index.php/opinions-on-sports/comments/kilkennys-jet-carries-larry-scott-to-visit-big-12-schools/
but weather blew that plan apart, so at the moment he’s still in Austin – or at least, the plane he’s been using all weekend is.
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/N228PK
In the immortal words of the pin I got while an undergrad: Roses are red, violets are blue...f*** $C.
Never know
Maybe Lew Perkins went down to Austin to show how much they want to be a part of the Pac 16.
R.I.P. Derrick Thomas. The Chiefs and the World have never been the same since your untimely death.
by ChiefsFan90s on Jun 14, 2010 12:06 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I believe I read
A report saying that they were meeting tonight. I don’t remember where since its been another crazy morning of “news” and “reports”
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
by mstreeter06 on Jun 14, 2010 12:08 PM CDT up reply actions
Orange County (California) Register
http://ucla.freedomblogging.com/2010/06/13/pac-10-expansion-scott-in-austin-kansas-next/16411/
In the immortal words of the pin I got while an undergrad: Roses are red, violets are blue...f*** $C.
Thanks
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
by mstreeter06 on Jun 14, 2010 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions
http://www.ocregister.com/sports/texas-253262-meet-scott.html
R.I.P. Derrick Thomas. The Chiefs and the World have never been the same since your untimely death.
by ChiefsFan90s on Jun 14, 2010 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions
Does that map have Maryland going to a dissolving Big XII, and ISU and Baylor going to SEC?
Also, this pic has Utah going to the Pac 1×. Whoever made this does not know what he is talking about.
R.I.P. Derrick Thomas. The Chiefs and the World have never been the same since your untimely death.
by ChiefsFan90s on Jun 14, 2010 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions
I think that was the point...
maybe wrong.
by WillieWannabe on Jun 14, 2010 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions
Lol
Wait, the pic also has A&M going to Mexico, and Colorado going to Canada.
Should have looked at it again before I posted anything. Looks like whoever made this is just being a smartass. :)
R.I.P. Derrick Thomas. The Chiefs and the World have never been the same since your untimely death.
by ChiefsFan90s on Jun 14, 2010 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions
I wouldn't rule out Colorado to Canada...
they have very similar beliefs on a certain “cash crop”
53 Conference Championships!! and now 6 IN A ROW!!! Holy Hell...Good Luck with That!!
Actually I realised it was fake when it has A&M going to Mexico...
Without UTEP.
R.I.P. Derrick Thomas. The Chiefs and the World have never been the same since your untimely death.
by ChiefsFan90s on Jun 14, 2010 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Everyone knows
that the nation college football team of Mexico is the Texas Longhorns.
There simply is no substitute for experience.
I like how it has KState moving to...
Hutchinson?
by mikedrawjayhawk on Jun 14, 2010 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions
If the Big 12
Works out a deal to somehow stay together and I’m still very skeptical, would it be in the league’s best interests to expand from 10 adding 2-6 teams?
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
They might add two more
But Dan Beebe and Texas would never go for more than 12.
R.I.P. Derrick Thomas. The Chiefs and the World have never been the same since your untimely death.
by ChiefsFan90s on Jun 14, 2010 12:26 PM CDT up reply actions
Adding 2+
restores the ability to have a championship game. Big $$$.
In the immortal words of the pin I got while an undergrad: Roses are red, violets are blue...f*** $C.
That's my thinking
Who then? Utah and TCU? I’ve seen that Arkansas could be interested.
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
by mstreeter06 on Jun 14, 2010 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions
Denver makes a great point about not
considering TCU or Houston since it could really foul up our recruiting efforts.
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
Oh ya that's right
Then what about Utah and Arkansas (if possible). That would make the Big 12 even stronger I would think.
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
by mstreeter06 on Jun 14, 2010 12:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Utah's probably
now to be in the Pac-12, if reports of the last few minutes mean UT is staying put.
In the immortal words of the pin I got while an undergrad: Roses are red, violets are blue...f*** $C.
Yeah
Snatch them while they’re hot. Big 12 needs to be proactive and this would be a great move to start patching up the league.
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
by mstreeter06 on Jun 14, 2010 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions
...I meant, they're already basically the Pac's backup plan.
99% odds they’ve already been given (or promised) a provisional Pac offer if/when Texas et al back out.
In the immortal words of the pin I got while an undergrad: Roses are red, violets are blue...f*** $C.
Yeah I know
But one can have false hope haha
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
by mstreeter06 on Jun 14, 2010 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions
I know I'm always asking these things
but how many new members has RCT added in the past month? There has to be a spike in membership…
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
I think Denver is behind this whole thing
To drive up traffic and membership. I know he is.
Shit happens when you win championships
by Andrew Clark on Jun 14, 2010 12:23 PM CDT up reply actions
do we get
laser beams?
"President Bartlet: A long flight across the night. You know why late flights are good? Because we cease to be earthbound and burdened with practicality. Asking important questions. Talking about the idea that nobody has thought about yet. Put it a different way...
Sam Seaborn: Be poets."
-The West Wing, Season Two, 'The Portland Trip'
East Coast turned Midwest
Okay -
interesting stats.
Last season RCT’s most active month was April (Calipari Saga, Henry recruitment) roughly 26,000 views
Since then, we’ve hit or surpassed that mark 8 times. March of this year we more than doubled that mark at 66,000 views.
Just 14 days into June, RCT is already up to 26,866 views. We have a chance to pass our all-time high without KU’s teams playing a down, hitting a jumpshot, or knocking in a run.
Is it bad that the past two years, our top months in terms of traffic were due to controversy rather than on-field discussion?
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
Where do you get to see these stats?
As a follow-up the stat man on here should make some pretty graphs
It's not that I'm lazy; it's that I just don't care.
His name is Warden 11
And he is not to be trusted
Shit happens when you win championships
by Andrew Clark on Jun 14, 2010 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions
scroll to the bottom of the site
and click the Site Minder link
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
Thats how Media is though
Controversy or Natural Disasters always bring in the most traffic
Shit happens when you win championships
by Andrew Clark on Jun 14, 2010 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions
Are we sure all of this wasn't to increase traffic
ahead of Denver’s identity reveal?
It's not that I'm lazy; it's that I just don't care.
I'd like to believe that's the real reason : )
53 Conference Championships!! and now 6 IN A ROW!!! Holy Hell...Good Luck with That!!
that was my theory during Mangino-gate
when we had our last spike.
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
54 to date...
but keep in mind we have quite a few one offs from other teams that have joined for a comment here and there but won’t likely be around long term. What I’m more excited about is the number of people that have gone from the onesy twosy comments here and there to regularly getting in the discussion, plus the increase in fan posts which is great.
53 Conference Championships!! and now 6 IN A ROW!!! Holy Hell...Good Luck with That!!
From Chip Brown, minutes ago
An announcement that a remodeled Big 12 will survive with a new television deal could be announced as early as Monday, sources say.
7 minutes ago via TweetDeck
All 10 schools remaining in the Big 12 are are at the table working on a deal that would save the league, sources tell Orangebloods.com.
8 minutes ago via TweetDeck
It's not that I'm lazy; it's that I just don't care.
why do I feel badly for cheering against this scenario?
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
because
of the possibility of it blowing up within 5 years again
by mikedrawjayhawk on Jun 14, 2010 12:30 PM CDT up reply actions
i don't get it
do we think that lew and every other non-texas AD is going to sign off on a deal that furthers the revenue disparity in texas’ favor?
it just doesn’t make sense that everyone is so ‘happy to keep things together’ that they are willing to turn the other cheek while texas builds the following:
"President Bartlet: A long flight across the night. You know why late flights are good? Because we cease to be earthbound and burdened with practicality. Asking important questions. Talking about the idea that nobody has thought about yet. Put it a different way...
Sam Seaborn: Be poets."
-The West Wing, Season Two, 'The Portland Trip'
East Coast turned Midwest
I always thought
that would hurt. I do like me some Duck Tales tho…
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
personally,
the possibility of having permanently imprinted money signs on my cheeks from diving into a pool of coin…
money
"President Bartlet: A long flight across the night. You know why late flights are good? Because we cease to be earthbound and burdened with practicality. Asking important questions. Talking about the idea that nobody has thought about yet. Put it a different way...
Sam Seaborn: Be poets."
-The West Wing, Season Two, 'The Portland Trip'
East Coast turned Midwest
Uh oh
RT @SPORTSbyBROOKS: Larry Scott / Pac-10 plan heading back to California. Apparently no trip to Kansas City. http://bit.ly/9k17yg
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
That sucks
But also could mean the Big 12 is officially staying together.
No Pac 10 for us. Thats bullshit. So you are coming here then you just turn around and leave?
Shit happens when you win championships
by Andrew Clark on Jun 14, 2010 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Plan filed for Stockton
San Francisco area kind of, but there have to be better options around there. Strange to choose Stockton, but sucks that it’s not here.
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/N228PK
In the immortal words of the pin I got while an undergrad: Roses are red, violets are blue...f*** $C.
So, is this like...ending? Soon?
"Not to be cliché or anything, but I’m Jayhawk born and Jayhawk bred and when I die I’ll be Jayhawk dead." - Ovechwin
who are you?
Beadlemaniacs - Award winning* college basketball blog (new and improved!)
College Hockey!
World Cup
has been an awesome distraction from all this BS huh?
by I need more Esteban on Jun 14, 2010 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions
i hate texas...
really, i do
"President Bartlet: A long flight across the night. You know why late flights are good? Because we cease to be earthbound and burdened with practicality. Asking important questions. Talking about the idea that nobody has thought about yet. Put it a different way...
Sam Seaborn: Be poets."
-The West Wing, Season Two, 'The Portland Trip'
East Coast turned Midwest
http://theshiver.com/forum/showthread.php?p=72512&posted=1#post72512
“As I put on here on Saturday, UT is the key to keeping the Big 12 together. They want their own network, and the Big 12 will likely allow that to happen should UT decide to stay. It’s unknown if the Pac 10 agreed to let that happen at all.
Thoughts are that this could end as soon as this afternoon.
If the Big 12 sticks around, we’ve heard that the league will go after Arizona, Arizona State quickly. Memphis, Arkansas and others are still in play too. Especially since it’s likely that A&M goes to the SEC and MU could still be Big 10 bound, or from what we’re told, MU could be talking to the SEC too.
This morning, we received word that KU has the offer it needs to join the Pac 10. We’re still chasing to get more than one source to verify this though. If UT, OU, OSU and TT head that way, KU should take that offer too. As I mentioned in my Saturday update, KU does have someone within the Pac 10 pushing KU. Also heard that the other Big 12 schools considering the Pac 10 have made a play for Kansas. Obviously the basketball program has pull here, and a lot of that pull is the amount of money the program makes. The KU basketball program brings in anywhere from 15-17 million a year. (15 million in 2009-10) That revenue, added to Kansas football revenue which is around 17 million, put Kansas well ahead of current Pac 10 schools like Stanford and Washington State who struggle to bring in 15million in football revenue alone. In the current Big 12, Kansas basketball rivals some schools football revenue as well. Kansas State – 21 million, Iowa State – 21 million, Texas Tech – 23 million, Missouri – 24 million, and Baylor – 11.8 million.
In total AD revenue, Kansas would rank very well in other conferences. 6th in the Big 12, 4th in Pac 10, 9th in SEC, 7th in Big 10, and 3rd in ACC." Matt Scott from the Shiver
Wow
So, like I’ve said numerous times, Basketball could be saving our ass (Riiiiivet).
Interesting that says we have a Pac 10 offer and that the other schools are aware of this as well. Maybe Texas and Co think we are going to jump so decide to jump too? I dunno.
To me it looks like KU and the south schools are all going to sit down and talk to everyone else and if it isn’t a dream scenario, are jumping ship
Shit happens when you win championships
by Andrew Clark on Jun 14, 2010 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions
Rivet's point is that
if we had invested in football years ago then we would have had a golden parachute like Nebraska. I’m not so sure tho. Mizzou has been trying to transform themselves into a football school for ages and it doesn’t seem to stick…
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
Yes
not putting enough into football (or putting the wrong people in charge) got us into this mess; although maybe the b-ball program can get us out.
Would you like to follow me on Twitter, Facebook, or my blog...well you can't.
by SagehenMacGyver47 on Jun 14, 2010 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Go, go, go
Go to the PAC-10 come hell or high water…fuck texas.
BOOM YOSTED!
by Home Run Tony Cogan on Jun 14, 2010 12:48 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
yep
I’m done with this one horse town.
At first I was mourning rivalries lost and the sentimental value that is still attached to the old Big8. But with Nebraska and Colorado gone and Texas seemingly even MORE in control the more that it seems the Big XII is not the place I’d want to be.
Get me on the first wagon out of town. Once again, all trails from here will head West.
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
Yeah, same on Texas
for looking out for their own interests. How dare they do that.
I just don’t understand the hatred here.
There simply is no substitute for experience.
It's the same hatred
that anyone would feel who is out of power and is being helplessly manipulated by those in power, and all the while watching their overlords absorb more power.
It makes sense to me…
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
a la...
the new york yankees
"President Bartlet: A long flight across the night. You know why late flights are good? Because we cease to be earthbound and burdened with practicality. Asking important questions. Talking about the idea that nobody has thought about yet. Put it a different way...
Sam Seaborn: Be poets."
-The West Wing, Season Two, 'The Portland Trip'
East Coast turned Midwest
Same reason I hate the MLB.
No offense to your team intended scouted.
R.I.P. Derrick Thomas. The Chiefs and the World have never been the same since your untimely death.
by ChiefsFan90s on Jun 14, 2010 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions
Royals fandom and a hate for
teams like the Yankees being successful is certainly solid ground for hating the MLB of late…
--VegasCat07
none taken
i grew up watching the yankees when they had scott brosius, john wetteland and a young derek jeter… they still had steinbrenner’s money, but they hadn’t started to write blank checks every offseason yet
"President Bartlet: A long flight across the night. You know why late flights are good? Because we cease to be earthbound and burdened with practicality. Asking important questions. Talking about the idea that nobody has thought about yet. Put it a different way...
Sam Seaborn: Be poets."
-The West Wing, Season Two, 'The Portland Trip'
East Coast turned Midwest
I grew up hating the Yankees
My brothers would tell me stories of Russ Chambliss at night to scare me. In fact I think I hated the Yankees before I found a team to love.
To bad I live in NYC…
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
not hatred, at least not from me
but i don’t want to get 5 years down the road and get caught with our pants down…this conference has never been unified and just has been a group of institutions looking out for themselves, with no leadership at the top.
BOOM YOSTED!
by Home Run Tony Cogan on Jun 14, 2010 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions
Understandable
I have a unique perspective being a Jayhawk living in Austin.
The vast majority of my Longhorn neighbors that I spoke with this weekend all said the same thing: they want to keep the Big 12 together. I didn’t get the sense from them that they wanted to keep it alive because they COULD or because it was the best thing for them. It was more a regional thing. Teams in our part of the country should be playing teams in our part of the country. Not flying out to Palo Alto, CA or Eugene, OR or Gainsville, FL.
All of them seems a bit peeved at A&M though!
There simply is no substitute for experience.
+1
flying to Washington St. is an absurd thing for student athletes
by I need more Esteban on Jun 14, 2010 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions
in a sense, it's a Midwest vs. coast thing
We’re always getting upset about the coasts getting all the hype and attention, and for the last week we’ve been torn between the two. If the league stays together, I see it as part of a show of solidarity that the midwest can work and grow together.
by mikedrawjayhawk on Jun 14, 2010 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Regarding a saved Big 12
I don’t think they’d expand- at least not right away. TX and OU have expressed dislike for the championship game because it can hurt BCS chances. Not to mention the whole thing keeping this together right now is the added revenue from lesser mouths at the watering hole- if you add two more schools, just waters down that profit more.
I really don’t think the B12 is going to expand, at least not right away.
by mikedrawjayhawk on Jun 14, 2010 12:54 PM CDT reply actions
In that case -
do we get rid of the divisions? Do we only play 3 non-cons?
The Kansas City Royals; Successfully failing since 1986
the proposal I heard was
a 9-game conference schedule. Everyone plays each other.
by mikedrawjayhawk on Jun 14, 2010 1:14 PM CDT up reply actions
If TA&M leaves, then it would be 8 league games, and
undefeated winner (i.e., UT) goes to the NC game and 2nd (OU) goes to a BCS game. Not a bad situation for the football heavies. UT gets $ from the network, so that assuages the cash grab needs.
Would you like to follow me on Twitter, Facebook, or my blog...well you can't.
by SagehenMacGyver47 on Jun 14, 2010 1:16 PM CDT up reply actions
think if you go to a PAC-16
If you’re UT, you have to beat OU, and maybe USC and/or Oregon, THEN play in the conf champ game against USC and/or Oregon again to get to the NC game.
Would you like to follow me on Twitter, Facebook, or my blog...well you can't.
by SagehenMacGyver47 on Jun 14, 2010 1:18 PM CDT up reply actions
In the Big "12" with only 10 or 9
you get the Ohio State Plan: win 4 patsy games, run through the not-so-difficult conference with 0 or 1 losses, and get a trip to the NC game.
Would you like to follow me on Twitter, Facebook, or my blog...well you can't.
by SagehenMacGyver47 on Jun 14, 2010 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions
It would depend on who we add.
Arkansas would bring in basically a whole state (Hog fans are a lot like Husker fans). Adding a few teams like that might actually help revenue, particularly if its based — at least in part — on television dollars.
I presume you mean they are similar
in that the state as a whole pulls unilaterally for one school? And not the rest of Husker fan stereotypes (this is not a way of saying I consider the other widely held descriptions of Husker fans to be false)…
--VegasCat07
It has been my experience ...
… that either interpretation could be equally valid.
by JacinB on Jun 14, 2010 4:17 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
aTm
I have lots of questions about the Aggies:
1. What is their appeal to the SEC on their own? The Houston market? Do they bring more to the table than they take away by dividing the “pie” up 13 ways instead of 12?
2. Can the Big “12” stick together with 9 teams? Can the 9 agree on who to bring in to replace those that have left?
3. If the SEC adds aTm, they’ll add another team to balance the schedule, right? So assuming they raid the ACC for team #14, doesn’t this create a whole other round of this crap? Then we’re looking at the ACC raiding the Big East for 1-3 teams, perhaps the Big Integer adding Rutgers/Cuse to also get to 14, and the Big East comes after KU again… (Head explodes).
Does Texas A&M control the fate of the universe right now?
You can never have too much talent.
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Jun 14, 2010 2:11 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
just my take on it
1. Houston market must be the answer there, also with TX the state depending on how League Network/TV contracts are structured.
2. The Big East makes football work with 8. Sure they’re the lowest BCS conference, but that has more to do with the schools’ recent performance (these things all go in phases) than their lack of 10/12 members (i.e., they don’t have OU and Texas is more important than they don’t have 12 teams).
3. Who knows what the next dominoes to fall are, but it does seem like finding a “stable” situation needs to be near the top of KU’s realignment (or lack thereof) goals. But is having 16 teams in one conference really any more suspect? Or 14 if you’re the SEC? I say better to be 1 of 9 (or 10) shooting for a BCS bid than 1 of 14 (or 16).
Would you like to follow me on Twitter, Facebook, or my blog...well you can't.
by SagehenMacGyver47 on Jun 14, 2010 2:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Houston is the 6th largest market in the country.
Dallas is the fourth. I don’t know how much aTm plays in Dallas but it isn’t any farther away from Dallas than Austin.
All the new reports
have the remaining 10 of the Big XII staying together, so it looks for the moment that it’s a moot point. It did seem like they had the option of blowing up the entire conference, though.
In the immortal words of the pin I got while an undergrad: Roses are red, violets are blue...f*** $C.
So the SEC flirtation
Was pure posturing to show the alumni base, “See? We’re not just UT’s lapdog!” Wow. It’s amazing how petty fanbases get when they haven’t won anything in a while.
You can never have too much talent.
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Jun 14, 2010 5:01 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Can't wait to see how much this deal favors Texas.
I have a feeling it’s going to be ridiculous. I mean who do we really think Dan Beebe is out there making deals for?
hearing kk get ripped a new one by his partner...
is fantastic. is there a way we can start a petition to get rid of kk like he wanted to get rid of bob knight on espn?
"President Bartlet: A long flight across the night. You know why late flights are good? Because we cease to be earthbound and burdened with practicality. Asking important questions. Talking about the idea that nobody has thought about yet. Put it a different way...
Sam Seaborn: Be poets."
-The West Wing, Season Two, 'The Portland Trip'
East Coast turned Midwest
Yes there is a way
Don’t listen to the guy. Boom. Problem solved.
There simply is no substitute for experience.
it's true
the world cup is a blessed distraction
"President Bartlet: A long flight across the night. You know why late flights are good? Because we cease to be earthbound and burdened with practicality. Asking important questions. Talking about the idea that nobody has thought about yet. Put it a different way...
Sam Seaborn: Be poets."
-The West Wing, Season Two, 'The Portland Trip'
East Coast turned Midwest
I know there were some hopes that KU would go to the PAC
but let’s think of it this way: if the Big 12 pulls through this, we get a new deal and more money with the same travel as before, while staying in a league that we know and can compete respectively in football (remember, we have put up some decent fights against TX and OU before).
On top of that, the B12 gets to exercise the lawyers against NU and CU for ditching, and we get even more money, at the expense of them.
by mikedrawjayhawk on Jun 14, 2010 3:50 PM CDT reply actions
Hate to lose those 4 gimme wins a year though : )
53 Conference Championships!! and now 6 IN A ROW!!! Holy Hell...Good Luck with That!!
In B-Ball??
I actually can’t see anyone that still remains in the “Big12” as challenging us in b-ball. I look forward to a harder schedule. The problem is that I just don’t see the “south” making our schedule that much harder. The best b-ball in the Big 12 right now is at KU, K-State, and MU.
In football, well, it isn’t going to get any easier. But then again I say bring it on. KU needs to take another step in football anyways. That’s what Turner Gill was brought in to do.
I was only on the Pacific train if the B12 South went that way.
I’ve got no problem staying as is for the time being.
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
People ask me what I do in winter when there’s no baseball...Rock Chalk Talk
I agree completely
Even if it is onyl 5 years. That gives Self enough time to win another Championship or two, while also letting Gill build the program hopefully into a perenial 8-9 wins a season. Bring in more revenue where we have the most potential, football. Then when things crash down again, hopefully we will be in a much better position to market ourselves to other leagues.
It's not that I'm lazy; it's that I just don't care.
I'm still concerned
about the future and therefore would say I’m still probably leaning toward PAC, but it’s a moot point if the Texas schools stay together anyway.
Just trying to see the benefit either way.
by mikedrawjayhawk on Jun 14, 2010 4:41 PM CDT up reply actions
The only way this deal could really work...
Is if the new by-laws made it much more difficult for teams to leave. Right now, there is a fundamental mistrust between basically Mizzou, The South (except Baylor), and the Rest of Us. Just trying to match the money that other conferences dole out to teams isn’t enough to fix this long term.
If Dan Beebe was smart (feel free to go ahead and ignore the rest of this paragraph, because he isn’t), he would realize that the only way this is really going to work is if those three groups make a significant commitment towards eachother right now. And the only way we can really do that is to make it incredibly painful financially to leave, IMO. And I don’t think you can do that with just a flat rate. When the Big 12 was created, forcing teams to pay a $10MM penalty to leave was probably considered absurd. As the college sports world has rapidly changed, it still made financial sense for schools to leave. Maybe the rule should be forfeiture of your last three years of television revenues across all sports.
The problem, of course, is that two of the aforementioned groups will likely continue to play footsie with other conferences, so they won’t want this to happen. A strong commissioner could see this and probably get it rammed through. Instead, we have Dan Beepe, who is currently saying the following to his secretary, according to EDSBS:
“17 million? Is that a big number? I DON’T KNOW JUST TELL ME! How bout a billion? No? It sounds bigger because it has a ’B” in front of it, but is that more money? Dammit I glued my fingers to the table again. Bring the speakerphone over here. I’ll operate it with my nose. OW MY NOSE NO ONE TOLD ME THE SPEAKERPHONE WOULD MAKE MY NOSE ALL HURT-Y—"
You can never have too much talent.
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Jun 14, 2010 5:38 PM CDT reply actions
Why not some sort of amount
that is equally complex as the BCS formula?
Taking into account dollars earned since the ‘Big XII’ inception, value to the conference, past asshole-ness, and
something exponentially proportional to conference victories and championships?
--VegasCat07
Report: Texas declines Pac 10 invite
RT @Big12_Spotlight: Chuck Carlton of the Dallas Morning News: Larry Scott confirmed that Texas has declined an invitation to join Pac-10. Wow.
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
Oops sorry
Saw it on the Twitterz and didn’t think to post the link.
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
Well...
Go Big12.
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
People ask me what I do in winter when there’s no baseball...Rock Chalk Talk
The Big X maybe? :)
Pronounce it like the letter, but it could stand for the Roman numeral for 10.
by hunter s. royal on Jun 14, 2010 6:01 PM CDT up reply actions
Screw this.....
I still dont want to be a league with Texas. If you read the artical, it basically says that Texas gets to fuck is all over again on revenue. You cant compete with Texas if you keep giving them your money. I can tell you right now, there are teams that will still jump ship no matter what they say right now, if the right offer comes along. I just wish we had a Chancellor with balls instead of one wearing a dress.
exactly
luck them
Would you like to follow me on Twitter, Facebook, or my blog...well you can't.
by SagehenMacGyver47 on Jun 14, 2010 5:54 PM CDT up reply actions
*lucky
Would you like to follow me on Twitter, Facebook, or my blog...well you can't.
by SagehenMacGyver47 on Jun 14, 2010 5:56 PM CDT up reply actions
Still have 11 though,
so Utah?
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
People ask me what I do in winter when there’s no baseball...Rock Chalk Talk
Unless they want regular trips to Vegas, it has to be.
Although Kansas does border one of their conference states now…
You can never have too much talent.
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Jun 14, 2010 7:02 PM CDT up reply actions
If this is true, it seems like a band-aid of a deal. Yeah, the rest of the B12 makes more money right now—but it buys time for teams to do behind-closed-doors deals. Texas will get its TV network deal, everybody will make more money, and the B10 becomes the B12 and the B12 becomes the B10?
One thing remains clear: Dan Beebe is an idiot of the highest order.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Should the Big 12 now target
Notre Dame and 1 of the following: Arizona, Arizona State (both rumored to be talked to as far back as 2 weeks ago) Memphis, Arkansas and Louisville? Memphis would be my choice along with ND. Fedex is reportedly offering $10 million to whomever takes Memphis in a BCS conference.
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
Why would ND want to join the B12 over the B10?
I can’t find one reason.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Only 12 teams in league
As supposed to 14+? I’m not sure of the finances but couldn’t you offer ND a nice steak in the revenue sharing to bring them in?
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
Notre Dame's high academic standards and geographical base fall in line more with the Big 10 than the Big 12.
And I am not sure how much $$$ the NBC deal is worth, but it surely has to be comparable with any deal the Big 12 could offer.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Ahh gotcha
It just seems like ND would make the Big 12 very strong. Pipedream I’m sure though.
....my quick smells like french toast...
Twitter: @mstreeter06
Let's get off this "high academic standards" thing.
Yes, the Big 10 has Northwestern, Purdue, and Michigan. After that, they are pretty much like the Big 12. They added Nebraska, explain how that falls in line with the High Academic Standards of the Big 10. Texas and Texas A&M are huge highly regarded academic Universities. KU, MU, OU, and Iowa St. are all good academic Universities. Baylor has a massive medical school and I’m not sure if it factors into its academic rankings. Northwestern should be factored when determining the Big 10 academics because it certainly doesn’t factor in athletics.
After all of that, I’m not arguing that the Big 10 isn’t better academically than the Big 12. I’m just not going to let you sit and act like the Big 10 is the Ivy League and the Big 12 is a collection of community colleges.
Correction
**Northwestern SHOULDN’T be factored when deternming the Big 10 academics.
CFN just published the latest APRs. There are 6 Big 10 schools (UI #4, NU #4, OSU #10, PSU #15, IU #20, UW #22) before the first Big 12 (OU, #33). Not that this is any way the comprehensive list of high academics for a university, but it is telling, and useful in compiling a picture of the academic landscape of the B10 and B12.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
APR is far from what I'd use to discuss academics of the universities.
Glad I came, just wish I hadn't stayed so long.
People ask me what I do in winter when there’s no baseball...Rock Chalk Talk
That's why I said:
useful in compiling a picture of the academic landscape
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
I'm going to go with Warden on this.
You could (arguably) be at literally the worst academic university in the country and headline the APR simply by having a head football coach that forces the players to excel academically. This said nothing about the academic’s of the university as a whole.
Again, I’m not arguing that the Big 10 on the whole doesn’t have better academics but it isn’t the Ivy League. Personally, I think the Pac 10 outclasses the Big 10 academically.
Now, I don’t think ND is coming to the Big 12. It has no connections or reason to do so. If it goes to the Big 10 it won’t be because the Big 10 has “good” academics and the Big 12 has “bad” academics. It will go because it has a long history of playing Big 10 teams and it won’t join until the Big 10 keeps it from being able to play it’s teams.
If you don't like APR, use endowment, or US News & World Report, or shitloads of other measures.
The Big 10 is better than the Big 12 academically.
Or USNWR, in March of 2010, posted school’s rankings according to their rankings. School / Ranking / Mascot. Big 12 (47 – T3):
1 University of Texas–AustinAustin, TX 47 Longhorns
2 Texas A&M University–College StationCollege Station, TX 61 Aggies
3 University of Colorado–BoulderBoulder, CO 77 Buffaloes
4 Baylor UniversityWaco, TX 80 Bears
5 Iowa State UniversityAmes, IA 88 Cyclones
6 University of KansasLawrence, KS 96 Jayhawks
7 University of Nebraska–LincolnLincoln, NE 96 Cornhuskers
8 University of MissouriColumbia, MO 102 Tigers
9 University of OklahomaNorman, OK 102 Sooners
10 Kansas State UniversityManhattan, KS Tier 3 Wildcats
11 Oklahoma State UniversityStillwater, OK Tier 3 Cowboys
12 Texas Tech UniversityLubbock, TX Tier 3 Red Raiders
And Big 10 (12 – 71):
1 Northwestern UniversityEvanston, IL 12 Wildcats
2 University of Michigan–Ann ArborAnn Arbor, MI 27 Wolverines
3 University of Illinois–Urbana-ChampaignChampaign, IL 39 Fighting Illini
4 University of Wisconsin–MadisonMadison, WI 39 Badgers
5 Pennsylvania State University–University ParkUniversity Park, PA 47 Nittany Lions
6 Ohio State University–ColumbusColumbus, OH 53 Buckeyes
7 Purdue University–West LafayetteWest Lafayette, IN 61 Boilermakers
8 University of Minnesota–Twin CitiesMinneapolis, MN 61 Golden Gophers
9 Indiana University–BloomingtonBloomington, IN 71 Hoosiers
10 Michigan State UniversityEast Lansing, MI 71 Spartans
11 University of IowaIowa City, IA 71 Hawkeyes
And just for fun, Pac 10 (4 – T3):
1 Stanford UniversityStanford, CA 4 Cardinal
2 University of California–BerkeleyBerkeley, CA 21 Golden Bears
3 University of California–Los AngelesLos Angeles, CA 24 Bruins
4 University of Southern CaliforniaLos Angeles, CA 26 Trojans
5 University of WashingtonSeattle, WA 42 Huskies
6 University of ArizonaTucson, AZ 102 Wildcats
7 Washington State UniversityPullman, WA 106 Cougar
8 University of OregonEugene, OR 115 Ducks
9 Arizona State UniversityTempe, AZ 121 Sun Devils
10 Oregon State UniversityCorvallis, OR Tier 3 Beavers
Top to bottom, the Big 10 is better than the Big 12 and Pac 10. Listen, I don’t have a horse in this race—I have a BS from a B10 school, and am getting my PhD at a B12 school. But yes, the Big 10 is inferior to Big 10 academics.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
Well that makes the Big 12's academics look even worse.
"The riches of the game are in the thrills, not the money." --Ernie Banks
The Big 10's
new add goes at the bottom of that list – 25 ‘spots’ behind the previous bottom school…
And in case you couldn’t tell, the Big 12 isn’t trying to tout academics as any reasons for current conference decisions. They all (read: Big 10, Big 12, Pac#, SEC, etc etc) want more money. Some have the ability to disguise it a bit to the public (if they so choose) as being about academics. Yes, adding NU does make more money (Conf title game) and at least is a decent academic add but don’t kid yourself – the expansion was about money money money.
'Fact. Bears eat beets. Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica.' --Jim Halpert
This whole thing is about making money
and NU got the Big 10/11/Dozen a football championship game and another ‘national brand’. Those equate to more $$$.
The fact that NU fits somewhat well into the academic mold of the Big 10/11/Dozen just the Big 10/11/Dozen considering/labeling/being itself academically superior (CIC here I suppose) as a conference keeps money rolling in from the CIC (and any source academically connected).
The money aspect boils down to, well, money. Any academic argument to be made in this realignment/expansion realm boils down to money in the end. The athletic competitiveness can be touted too – which boils down to money really. As has been pointed out elsewhere, the Big 10/11/Dozen would be going after Yale, Brown, Columbia, Harvard, Penn, Princeton, Dartmouth, and/or Cornell if academics were the #1, dominant, and controlling factor.
Where was I going with this?… … … Ah yes – ND to Big 10/11/Dozen vs Big 12/X. ND would choose the Big 10/11/Dozen there due to money. The academics would be a nice alternative that they can point to when trying to seem less interested in money, but really it would be due to money (The TV $$$ being greatest in the one they choose supports this).
--VegasCat07
Notre Dame wanted to be in a 12 team league.
However, I agree that ND is not coming because I doubt we expand past 10, even though I would personally like to get back to 12.
R.I.P. Derrick Thomas. The Chiefs and the World have never been the same since your untimely death.
by ChiefsFan90s on Jun 14, 2010 10:01 PM CDT up reply actions
Notre Dame will never join a conference for football.
They would rather destroy the whole damn school at this point than give up their independence. They’ve been offered 3X the money to join the Big Ten. The Big Ten Consortium would be fantastic for their academics (in fact, the faculty has voted before that they want to join the Big Ten). But it just doesn’t matter.
It would be like KU changing its colors to black and gold, or getting rid of the rock chalk cheer. It’s that fundamental to the fabric of the school. Does it make sense? Not to me. But that’s just the way it is.
You can never have too much talent.
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Jun 14, 2010 7:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
