RCT Heisman polling
by JayhawkTom on Dec 8, 2009 10:06 AM CST
48 comments
So, yeah, Mangino may have been a little hasty in pimping out Todd Reesing for Heisman consideration, although at the time, coming off of a scintillating performance against Iowa State and a heart-stopping, near comeback at Colorado (after puking on himself - twice, dammit), he was worthy of consideration.
Alas, the weeks passed and the fixed eye of Heisman punditry turned its steely glare to the southern states, where young men performed deeds of punishing physicality and derring-do in hopes of meriting a December invite to the Downtown Athletic Club and the hoisting of the bronzed prize. Meanwhile, in the west, there were equal feats of strength (no Festivus relationship) being performed by a near-mythical man-beast, a brutish grinder in the Riggins mold, and dazzling young southpaw.
But enough with the prose.
RCT-ers, who's yer 2009 Heisman winner? Are you a 'best player on best team' type (Ingram? McCoy?) Or do you go with the traditionalists' view of 'most outstanding player in collegiate football' (Suh? Tebow?). Are you a 'but he didn't play well enough in games his team lost' type (Spiller? Keenum?), or a 'consistent performer' type(Gerhardt? Moore?)
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I had the same thought...thanks for posting...
My vote goes to Suh. The Heisman is for the most dominant player in college football and in a year where no one jumps off the page offensively it’s time to give credit to a guy that absolutely dominates defensively. It’s a shame he likely doesn’t stand much chance but I’d vote for Suh hands down.
Coincidentally his worst game may have been against us.
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
Voted for him too...
and still can’t believe how much we controlled him. We need to figure out how to use Jeff Spikes, because apparently the ability IS there.
by hiphopopotamus on Dec 8, 2009 10:42 AM CST up reply actions
I'd love to see a line of...
Hawkinson, Marrongelli, Hatch, Spikes and Thorson. I like Capra but I think Marrongelli and Spikes have the potential to be special players.
Also, HipHop…anything new on the coaching front?
Sounds like there is now a statement from Nutt stating he is happy at Ole Miss and staying that he released after the interview. Seems like maybe Lew has his guy then. Either Gill or someone we haven’t heard too much about maybe?
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
Nothing too new...
my source from yesterday said he was wrong and our Harbaugh interview was this morning instead. (Wouldn’t take it to the bank, though)
I’d agree with your sentiment on the Nutt thing – gives him a way to save face in front of Ole Miss.
by hiphopopotamus on Dec 8, 2009 11:27 AM CST up reply actions
I would love to put this thing to bed this week...
with a good hire that quickly this could go a long way toward continued improvement at Kansas
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
I very much expect
to hear something by the end of the week.
by hiphopopotamus on Dec 8, 2009 11:31 AM CST up reply actions
care to take a stab at a prediction?
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
Gun to my head...
at this point I’d guess Harbaugh.
Maybe I’ve just fallen for all this hype, but I’ve heard good things from both sides of the camp.
by hiphopopotamus on Dec 8, 2009 1:36 PM CST up reply actions
At the moment...
I think I’d be happy with one of these four…
Harbaugh
Holtz
Fedora
Gill
Fedora hasn’t been mentioned since the beginning but he has expressed interest to my knowledge. Just not sure if it’s being reciprocated.
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
yep.
100%.
And thinking back to the Terry Allen days, I would have laughed in your face if you told me that’s who we were going after (and would get).
by DCJayhawk0208 on Dec 8, 2009 2:43 PM CST up reply actions
What made Fredrick hire Terry Allen in the first place?
Does anyone remember what redeeming qualities he had coming in?
Me no likey Clint Bowen.
and...
continued recruiting the same caliber of player : )
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
And our AD, Roy Williams loved
the fact that Terry had no problems being second tier in the KU athletic hierachy.
Who's next?
that dad gummed son of a gun.
Me no likey Clint Bowen.
by labbadabba on Dec 8, 2009 3:59 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I'll always rec Roy jokes.
I used to work with an old man that told me- Son, every workplace has a dumbass. If you don't have one where you work, then I'm afraid you're it.
WTF happened to his arm, btw?
RODD TEESING, my arch-nemesis! Give us back our TODD, you rapscallion!
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Dec 8, 2009 9:05 PM CST up reply actions
He always has medical drama on the sideline
Passing out, being in a sling, seriously does any other head coach have so many sideline injuries/issues?
Fell down playing golf.
It's a dangerous sport
by hunter s. royal on Dec 8, 2009 10:04 PM CST up reply actions
A lot of that was offensive scheme
Warinner rolled Todd out of the pocket a LOT….make Suh run a few extra yards to get to the QB.
UT’s Greg Davis, on the other hand, chose (?) to keep McCoy in the pocket and let him be terrorized by the beast. Made absolutely no sense to me.
Who's next?
definitely well schemed game for us...
the offense finally seemed to regain a little bit of confidence at times in that game. Although I do think Spikes might be better suited on the interior, he looked pretty good at guard.
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
We schemed well...
and Todd did some rolling out, but that was not the entire reason at all. Not only did he not have sacks, he was barely in the backfield. A very impressive job by Spikes (and Hatch on the double), especially when you factor in how well Toben ran the ball up the middle.
Again, I’m with you Denver. He’s a guard. He just never figured out how to set his feet in pass protection on the outside. But he’s still quick off the ball going forward and has good hands (if he gets them on you).
by hiphopopotamus on Dec 8, 2009 11:30 AM CST up reply actions
This guy wants to know what's wrong with crying on TV...
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
Morrison and Tebow share a few common similarities
They both were dominant in college, they both cried, and they both are going to have zero pro careers
It was really tough to read the bible verse on his eyeblack due to the tears...
Me no likey Clint Bowen.
by labbadabba on Dec 8, 2009 12:38 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
He's on a roll.
I used to work with an old man that told me- Son, every workplace has a dumbass. If you don't have one where you work, then I'm afraid you're it.
I agree with Denver.
The big favorites coming into the year were not particularly impressive, and Suh took an offensively challenged team and had them a second away from a Big 12 title.
by hunter s. royal on Dec 8, 2009 10:59 AM CST up reply actions
Did I not say
at the beginning of the year that the Hatch/Suh match up would be sweet?
I win!
Me no likey Clint Bowen.
While Suh is a great pick
Toby Gerhart carried Stanford this season. Dominating running back. Both deserving, IMO.
Insanity is just a state of mind.
I wrassled with it
and went with Gerhardt. I watched three Stanford games this year, the loss to Cal (in which Garhardt was a beast), the SoCal game, and his Notre Dame performance. He was simply unstoppable for 60 minutes each time. Maybe not every carry was SportsCenter quality, but he just wore people out, and in the 4thQ, he was barrelling through them.
On the other hand, Suh’s performance, and noticably watched by this midwestern-based audience, was supremely dominant. Reminded me of Forrest Whitaker’s character in “Fast Times at Ridgemont High” after his Camaro gets trashed.
McCoy got a lot of help from Shipley, and vicey versey. Ingram seemed to play within the framework of the ’Bama offense and that helped afford him greatness.
Its got to be Ingram
Not by who deserves it more, but going with the current criteria of heisman voting. You have to be the best player on your team, on a team that is playing/was close to the title (rules out Gerhart and Suh) major conference (Keenam and etc) and beating Florida ruled out Tebow. It will come down to between Ingram and McCoy, I think last week gives Ingram the nod.
I don’t necessarily agree with the recent criteria for voting on the heisman, and Suh is a nasty force for sure (although before he went off in the Texas game he only had 8 sacks, which is great for a DT but I’m not sure if its enough to win a hesiman when the voters won’t take into account controlling the line, the stuffed runs, qb hurries, etc). In the end though with SO many good players who put up monster numbers in the game, I can sort of understand why it turns into an award for a team’s MVP playing for a title contender. Otherwise how do you sort through the monster numbers from other players?
All arguments on point
though we could see regional voting come into full effect as deserving candidates “rob” each other of support by sweeping regions. Gotta figure there’s still some Tebow support in the South and East to detract from Ingram’s basis, while Gerhardt may be the favorite out of the West with McCoy/Suh battling in the Midwest.
Last year’s race was pretty epic with some of the most divided regional voting in recent memory. Heck, Tebow got the most 1st place votes and finished 3rd overall.
I don't like this part
on a team that is playing/was close to the title
I don’t see why an incredible player should be punished for being surrounded by lesser talent. So basically you’re saying Ingram should win over, presumably, Gerhart because Ingram’s team was better? I thought this was an individual award.
Insanity is just a state of mind.
Like I said, I don't necessarily agree with it
But thats the way it shakes out. However, in the end team success might be crucial to decide between players. In the end, how do you differentiate from two star players with similar stats? The team they were on, the teams they played all year, etc?
While I think the award should go to the best player in the nation regardless, I can understand why voters more and more give it to someone on a contender, simply because there are so many great players and its harder and harder to differentiate between them.
For example lets look at the stats
Gerhart: 311 rushes 1,736 yards 26 TDs 5.6 average
Ingram: 249 rushes 1542 yards 15 TDs 6.2 average
While Gerhart has the better stats, most noticeably in touchdowns, should Ingram be punished for playing in a league where opposing defenses where incredibly better than Gerhart’s league (the Pac 10 simply does not play strong defense, the scores all season indicate such). Should Ingram get more of a boost for his team making the title game in a tougher leage? Should Gerhart get more of a boost for playing on a team in which he didn’t have a defense getting him the ball back over and over?
I think these are all fair questions for sure, and I certainly don’t have an answer. IMO, which ever player does not win the heisman should win the award for the nation’s top RB to be fair, thats how close it is for me between these two. Just me two cents.
Also, should Gerhart be punished for not having an O-line that was of the same caliber of Ingram’s? Yeah, the defense might balance that out, but Alabama recruits better O-lineman than Stanford. And Stanford passing game was nowhere Alabama’s, which wasn’t very good, but accounting for Julio Jones made defending Ingram much more difficult. My thinking is this, without Gerhart, I doubt Stanford is anyhwere near successful this season. With another running back, Alabama might be in the same spot. I’m not really sure, because Ingram is great, no doubt, but Gerhart did more for his team.
Insanity is just a state of mind.
Suh against Texas
What really blew my mind about Suh in that game was that he wasn’t just bull rushing the passer and collapsing the pocket- sometimes he would recognize a drag route coming over the middle, drop back a bit to ruin the timing on that route, and THEN would throw an o-lineman out of the way and come after McCoy.
He seems to have this great awareness of everything that’s going on around him during the scrum- he’s constantly diagnosing plays, figuring out their vulnerabilities, and THEN attacking.
Did everyone see that Kiper called him “the best #1 prospect in 32 years”?!?
RODD TEESING, my arch-nemesis! Give us back our TODD, you rapscallion!
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Dec 8, 2009 9:11 PM CST reply actions
I caught Kipers comment as well and that is some pretty high praise...
Also, I was listening to a former D-Lineman on sport radio out here in Denver and he was talking about a specific blocking technique that the Longhorns were throwing at Suh. Basically he said that the best lineman in the NFL that he knew were at best able to neutralize such a technique while Suh was consistently beating the block and making the play.
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
Suh is a machine
And seems to be ::knock on wood for his sake:: a pretty sure bet to come in and produce. He beat up on big12 lines all year, and any team that runs a 4-3 would be crazy not to grab him for an inside tackle position.
If you got a 4-3 defense with two decent if not better pass rushing ends and Suh in the middle that is a quarterback’s nightmare.
I've been asked by folks in Denver...
how he would fit as a DE in a 3-4. He seems athletic enough, I know it’s not the system he comes from but I recall him lining up at an end spot against Kansas and others in 3rd down situations.
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
Yeah but if you can find a legit pass rusher from the DT position
Its a premium. Already have two ends rushing the qb, throw in someone who can get to him from the inside, kablampow. Think Warren Sapp in Tampa those years when he was getting 12 or so sacks a season from a DT spot. If you can find someone to play tackle who stuffs the run and can also reach the qb thats pretty dangerous.
The Bears won too many games
for the Broncos to have a shot at Suh, otherwise he would make a great NT.
A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day.
by SlamDunkTheFunk on Dec 9, 2009 9:02 AM CST up reply actions
That was such a BS trade.
I said at the time that Cutler wasn’t worth 1 1st round draft pick much less two. Not to mention that we wanted out. The Bears WAY overpaid for Cry Baby.
Me no likey Clint Bowen.
lolollolololooololololololololol
BS nothin. I thought it was a great trade at the time and I sure as hell feel that way now.
A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day.
by SlamDunkTheFunk on Dec 9, 2009 9:23 AM CST up reply actions
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