Get to Know a Coaching Candidate: Turner Gill
by Owen on Dec 12, 2009 4:29 PM CST
in Kansas Jayhawk Football
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Next up on our get to know a coaching candidate series is one of the first names that popped up in the discussion even before the Kansas coaching position was even open.
Sitting at the Kansas versus Missouri game at Arrowhead I heard the name Turner Gill in connection with the position and discussed by the parents of players and an assistant coach from a fairly respected high school program in the state of Kansas.
The talked cooled a little bit from there but after today Gill has officially interviewed and is obviously a candidate for the position and may in fact prove to be the candidate for the position in the end. That said, let's get to know Turner Gill a little more.
Turner Gill hails from one of Kansas' prime recruiting grounds of late in Fort Worth Texas. Gill was a star high school player at Arlington Heights High School and heavily recruited by two Big Eight schools at the time in rivals Nebraska and Oklahoma. In the end Tom Osborne and the Huskers won out and the rest is history as Gill enrolled at the University of Nebraska in the fall of 1980.
Gill got his first break as a Husker when during the 1981 season Osborne inserted Gill into a game against Auburn trailing 3-0 at halftime. At this point the 1-2 Huskers were at a bit of a key moment in the season and Gill was the savior. Gill led the Huskers to a win against Auburn and followed that up with an unbeaten season in the Big 8 winning the conference outright for the first time in 10 years.
Gill again would lead the Huskers to the Big 8 title in both 1982 and 1983 as a junior and senior respectively. During his senior season Gill led a Husker offense averaging 52 points and over 400 yards per game. Gill would finish fourth in the Heisman trophy race an award won by teammate Mike Rozier.
Following Gill's prolific college career the NFL wasn't exactly beating down his door. However Gill did find his way into the CFL with the Montreal Concordes. In two seasons with the Concordes, Gill had 727 pass attempts with 411 completions for 4,928 yards and 23 touchdowns to 24 interceptions. He also had 826 rushing yards on 173 carries and seven touchdowns. His career was cut short however at the age of 23 after a series of serious concussions led to the recommendation that he call it quits.
After a few years experimenting with another passion in Major League Baseball Gill would return to Nebraska as a member of Tom Osbornes staff. Gill coached the quarterbacks for the Huskers from 1992-2003 and spent a final season in 2004 coaching the wide recievers. The name Turner Gill even then would pop up in association with coaching jobs but he never seemed to be the right fit or find the right position.
In 2005 with a changing of the guard so to speak in Lincoln Gill found himself with the Green Bay Packers organization as the Director of Player Development. Gill spent one season with the Packers before taking his current position at Buffalo.
In December of 2005 Gill agreed to a five year deal with the University of Buffalo to be their head coach. In four seasons Gill's teams have gone 2-10, 5-7, 8-6 and 5-7 this season. Gill's success in the 2008 season and a MAC Conference title led to his name popping up with some bigger name programs in Auburn and Syracuse. Both schools passed on Gill in favor of other candidates and Gill agreed to an extension at his current post making him one of the highest paid coaches in the MAC.
Skeptics of Gill believe he hasn't proven enough as a head man to warrent the reigns of a BCS program. In reality he has only put together one winning season as a head man, but he did do it in Buffalo. The other concern with Gill is similar to that of Harbaugh. Should the alma mater ever come calling, will Gill jump at an offer from the Corn? Gill was in the running prior to the hiring of Bo Pelini and if he one day blows a gasket so big Tom has to make a change, will Gill head home to his coach?
On the other hand Gill does have connections in the midwest, connections in the state of Texas and given the right opportunity he might be able to put his stamp on a program of his own. "Give Gill the resources and watch out" has been thrown around out there even.
Gill is a guy that someone is going to give a shot to someday, it's up to Lew to decide if Kansas is the school that wants to take that shot. It could end up being one hell of a hire or it could be one that Lew will live to regret. Regardless this isn't the "homerun" hire so it's bound to stir some emotions after the way Manginogate went down.
Personally, I think Kansas could do a lot worse than Gill and giving a young energetic guy with ties to the Big 12 a shot could prove to be a great move. Gill might not be my first choice, but he's a choice I could support 100%.
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I'd be very happy with this pick
The fact that he was able convince enough talented kids to go to college in friggin’ BUFFALO to a school that has been awful for 50 years to win 8 games is, frankly, a miracle. Buffalo averages 23 inches of snow…for the month of January. The median income for a Buffalo family is around $24,000 a year. You try convincing a Texas kid he should go somewhere like that to play for a team that has been a national joke for generations, and can’t really provide him with non-football opportunities once he graduates.
I like his ties to the NFL and the Dallas Metroplex. I like how he was able to develop a quarterback currently on the Ravens roster at Buffalo, which tells me he has the ability to pass on the knowledge he has about the position to his players. I like that it looks like he runs a version of the spread offense, which would hopefully ease the transition period with the players we already have in place.
After watching that dominant defensive performance in the Big 12 title game, I seriously doubt Bo Pelini will be going anywhere for a long, long time. Nebraska fans may never be able to get back to those ass-kicking option teams of the past, but they can at least continue on the proud Blackshirts tradition. And really, if they had even an average quarterback, that offense would be much, much better- Helu’s a good back, they seem to have a good o-line, etc.
I was pretty disgusted by the suggestion by some on the KUSports boards that this was a “token minority interview for PR purposes.” That’s a clear cheap shot to Mr. Gill’s resume and accomplishments, and shows that fundamentally, KU fans still have a lot to learn about the game of football, IMO.
Who are the “home run hires,” in your opinion? I wouldn’t put Fedora or Sumlin in that class yet, personally.
RODD TEESING, my arch-nemesis! Give us back our TODD, you rapscallion!
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Dec 7, 2009 10:31 PM CST reply actions
I wouldn't put Fedora or Sumlin in that class either...
Personally I’d feel better about Gill or Fedora over some of the “homerun” hires being tossed around.
I agree with much of what you said but I think it’s pretty clear that when his name gets tossed around people either love it or hate it.
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
by Owen on Dec 7, 2009 10:38 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
I'm in between
Like I said earlier, I feel like Gill is more of our fallback. I personally have nothing against him, I think he would be a great recruiter, yet have heard he may not be the best game-day coach and I would have liked to see a little more sustained success. Overall though I would have no objection with Turner Gill.
When I say fallback though, I get the sense that we would go with a Harbaugh or maybe even a Fulmer type if they said they were onboard first. Just my feeling.
by Andrew Clark on Dec 7, 2009 11:00 PM CST up reply actions
a little info...
KennyGregoryRockThaCradle, you clearly know nothing about the University at Buffalo. First of all, the main campus is located in Amherst not Buffalo. The median family income is around 69k not 28k. Also, the bulls went 5-7 because their RB James Starks (a Doak watch list candidate) was hurt before the start of the season. (He’s averaged 1,000 yards a season his first 3) This obviously killed an offense with a new QB and an emphasis on the run. Also, if you knew the history of the program, you would be more than impressed with the recruiting and coaching that he has brought to the university. He’s won more games in his 4 years than the program has in the last 10 or so years. Although the Bulls finished 5-7, if you look at the games they lost, 4 of those games were on the last drive and could have easily been 9-3 with a little luck.
Great info on the season...thanks for the input...
makes Gill even a more attractive candidate in my mind.
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
Interesting Option
I still am not sold on Gill. I think he has a lot of potential to be a solid head coach at a better school than Buffalo, but right now we don’t need potential. We have built ourselves into a legitimate bowl threat every year. I am just worried we might take a few too many steps back with this one. He has had one winning season, but Buffalo doesn’t really play any truly tough competition. I agree with KGRTC, that a winning season at Buffalo is truly remarkable. My first choice is still Sumlin. I think he could make some noise at Kansas.
Ok here's something I'm wondering about with Sumlin....
Does he bring Jackson Jeffcoat’s dad with him?
Potential
Seems like such a difficult concept, and Lew’s ability to parse through it will likely define his time in Lawrence.
Both Gill and Harbaugh have the same number of winning seasons in D-1 football. Harbaugh has a track record of success at D1-AA, but how well does that translate? I honestly don’t know the answer to that question. Did Harbaugh recruit Gehrhardt (sp?)? Where would the Cardinal be this year without Tony?
Is Sumlin really more proven than Gill? He has a couple of nice Big 12 South wins this year, but only has 2 years of head coaching experience. Fedora is basically in the same boat.
Seems like the safe play is to get either Tuberville, Fulmer, or Nutt. But after that, I’m not sure that any candidate is any more of a sure-thing than Gill.
Dunno, maybe I just pity anyone that is stuck in Buffalo. Heh.
RODD TEESING, my arch-nemesis! Give us back our TODD, you rapscallion!
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Dec 7, 2009 11:43 PM CST reply actions
Not sure on Nutt
I heard he was interested, contacted, etc…..but then read that wasn’t true. Doesn’t sound legit, but I would ecstatic if we could land him.
I'm not sure about Sumlin
Houston had absolutely NO defense this year. Even if we get an offensive minded coach, I’d like him to have connections to get someone to whip this D into shape
I'm liking Gill the more I hear about him...
…but I still think I’d prefer to have Harbaugh over him. Same number of winning seasons as a head coach at D-1 level but Harbaugh’s comes from a BCS conference against tougher competition. I dunno, I just think that provides a little bit of edge. At the same time, as others have said, I would not be unhappy with Gill, he seems legit and could probably do well at KU if he could keep us recruiting hot talent.
I don't know, I like to think that things started out initially with good intentions, but then we just loused it up. Kind of like intelligence. We have this glorious thing that allowed us to survive for millenia and now we use it to write porn film plots involving pterodactyls. Talk about wasting the gift.
Gill's mistreatment at Nebraska
A lot of KU alums come from Nebraska (myself being one of them), and I grew up in a diehard husker family. Gill wasn’t treated well there for his last few years. He was actually demoted to WR coach in ‘04 when Callahan was fired because Callahan was jealous of Turner’s ties to Osborne and didn’t think he could coach a pass-first “West Coast” offense. Not only that, but he was passed over for the HC job when Solich was fired. Granted, those things happened under the old regime (Steve Pederson as AD), but I think there’s a certain possibility that he would thoroughly enjoy putting the screws to NU if he had a chance. While children having minds of their own, especially children of big-name alumni, I am still a bit surprised his daughter chose KU over NU.
Stats:
I haven’t been able to find a lot of highlights online (shocking, I know), but there are some interesting statistics.
In 08, the Bulls ran a run-heavy offense (60/40 run/pass), gaining 3.8 yards per rush but but 7 yards per pass (and 10.9 yards per catch). That dropped to a 50-50 split in ’09 that was actually more productive, with 4.5 yards per rush, 7.2 yards per pass and 12.7 yards per catch.
In comparison, in 2007, KU was an (obviously) pass-heavy offense (58-42%), averaging 4.8 yards per rush, 7.9 yards per pass and 12.5 yards per catch).
What’s that tell us? Probably not a whole lot, other than that Gill adapts to the players he has rather than forcing them into his “philosophy.”
Buffalo graduated their QB, 3 starting offensive linemen and 3 starting defensive linemen in ’08.
This is an interesting statistic: While they committed 21 fumbles and forced 21 fumbles in ‘08 (recovering 10 of their own and 11 of their opponents’), that dropped to 16 fumbles in ’09, losing 8 of them. But they forced 38 fumbles, recovering 25 of them. Even in 2007, KU only forced 19 fumbles (recovering 12 of them).
If you want to check out the stats yourself:
UB08: http://www.ubathletics.buffalo.edu/football/stats/2008/teamcume.htm
UB09: http://www.ubathletics.buffalo.edu/football/stats/2009/TEAMCUME.HTM
KU07: http://www.kuathletics.com/sports/m-footbl/stats/2007-2008/teamcume.html
KU09: http://www.kuathletics.com/sports/m-footbl/stats/2009-2010/teamcume.html#TEAM
Fact:
Not once but twice one of our conference foes has passed over this guy.
If that’s not a huge red flag, I don’t know what is.
Who's next?
any thoughts as to why?
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
1. Steve Pederson was a worthless, selfish AD who had a compulsive need to separate himself from Tom Osborne (‘04). Callahan demoted Gill when he arrived, which led to Gill’s departure.
2. I’m not so sure of, because I know that a lot of the fans wanted Gill back after the Callahan “era.” But from what I’ve gathered, there was a lot of loyalty to Pelini, who really resurrected the Blackshirts in his year as an assistant. And after several years of Callahan’s pansy-ass defenses, a LOT of people really wanted to bring back the toughness of the “Blackshirts.” From what I remember, the general sentiment in Nebraska at the time was that defense trumped offense and Pelini was the solution.
I’ll touch base with my Dad, who’s pretty tied in with the program up there and see if he’s got any insider-y info on why Turner was passed over two years ago.
by PDXJayhawk on Dec 8, 2009 8:43 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
on the second pass over
There actually was a story about Pelini’s hiring a couple days ago in the Omaha World-Herald (which I can’t find online) where Osborne was pretty blunt about what happened. He said that his analysis was that the offense was in far better shape than the defense and that Pelini’s defensive experience won out over Gill’s offensive experience.
He also said calling Gill to tell him he didn’t get the job was the hardest thing he’s ever done (Osborne was the best man at Gill’s wedding).
We still could lose him if Pelini fails up North, though.
by PDXJayhawk on Dec 8, 2009 9:05 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
hmmm...
well now the offense has gone down the tubes and the defense is pretty damn good.
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
can't win 'em all!
And, at the time, that was before Patrick Witt at QB transferred. Granted, his statistics at Yale are arguably worse than Lee’s, but at the time, they seemed to be in pretty good position on O.
Fact:
Big 12 ADs have hired Dan Hawkins, Bill Callahan, Ron Prince, Steve Owens…
These guys are far from infallible decision-makers when it comes to football coaches.
RODD TEESING, my arch-nemesis! Give us back our TODD, you rapscallion!
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Dec 12, 2009 11:37 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
Now we're all just crossing our fingers that Turner Gill's name is never added to that list!
I used to work with an old man that told me- Son, every workplace has a dumbass. If you don't have one where you work, then I'm afraid you're it.
by Warden11 on Dec 13, 2009 8:50 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Come on
Get yourself a little Hawk Love.
A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day.
by A.J. Haefele on Dec 14, 2009 3:49 AM CST up reply actions
He's been against Gill for awhile.
I used to work with an old man that told me- Son, every workplace has a dumbass. If you don't have one where you work, then I'm afraid you're it.
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