Rock Chalk Sports Talk
Jon Cornish and Joe Mortensen on the show today. I've heard Jon's story and it's worth listening too. Not sure if Joe will have anything new to say or not. Should be interesting though. Just another point of view if anyone is still interested.
about 2 years ago
Owen
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I haven't listened yet
but Joe Mortensen’s comments are the first time I’ve heard someone give a firsthand account of the verbal abuse that they suffered.
At this point it appears that there is more than enough to oust Mangino.
I have very mixed feelings about this. I would not personally, nor would I want my children to put up with that type of shit. Having said that, this should have been addressed long ago and perhaps he should have been given a chance to fix his behavior. But, at this point I think you’ve got to move on for the university’s sake.
I strongly dislike the apparent way that ADLP has handled the situation, and all I’ve got to say is, if he’s gonna play his cards (by changing coaches and by doing it in this manner), he better be damn fucking sure that he’s got the winning hand.
"He once had an awkward moment, just to see how it felt...he lives vicariously...through himself- He is the most interesting man in the world"
by Home Run Tony Cogan on Nov 20, 2009 5:03 PM CST reply actions
Joe's comments were good....
took ownership of what he said…at the same time had some good things to say about KU. Wouldn’t change a minute of what happened. Loved KU…just didn’t have a relationship with coach and felt he crossed the line with his treatment of players. Says he’s taken some heat from some in the program for coming forward.
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
Cornish with very interesting thoughts...
-smart guy. In response to the Raymond Brown comment…
-says some players might need to be reminded of where they come from and how good they have it now. Kansas was giving guys a $20k scholarship. If they aren’t appreciating that perhaps they need reminded.
-doesn’t think this should be an issue
-Says he wasn’t afraid of Mangino, thought maybe players that have problem with him were. Need to realize he’s trying to bring out the best.
-Believes quality of character has dropped in the program. When he was recruiting first few classes, he wanted very solid character. Now he’s getting different players, star players and he maybe took some chances.
-Says you never would have heard of fights with basketball players when he was around. Embarrassed that those things are happening at his school.
-Says it was luck that he got on the field. Based on talent he should have been on the field much sooner but Mangino hated him due to injured hip. Got medical redshirt, next season…tore quad, didn’t bring it up…trainer at the time would play people to cater to Mangino. Forced to practice when he shouldn’t have, but not Mangino’s fault. Trainers said he was good to go and he expected him to go.
-Believes players today aren’t brought up in a way that they expect to work hard to achieve their goals. Maybe if they don’t play they complain.
-Did not respect the quotes of Hereford and Dexton Field who came out against Mangino. Says they came from a place that their opinions aren’t really valid. Also says he knew Joe Mort didn’t like Mangino but thinks he should have shown more respect because he helped him get to where he is.
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
This is the picture I think everyone's starting to come up with.
Now the question of whether or not MM can recover from this has to get answered.
I used to work with an old man that told me. Son, every workplace has a dumbass, if you don't have one where you work, then I'm afraid you're it.
Mortensen always struck me as a really classy guy
and his interview confirmed it. He didn’t say oh I hate KU blah blah blah. He was honest without being derogatory.
http://twinkietalk.com
http://thecollegehockeyblog.com
Found a VERY interesting post on KUSports.com
That I think is worth talking about:
2002: 2-10 (0-8), Non-con games against: UNLV, Missouri State, Bowling Green, Tulsa
2003: 6-6 (3-5), Non-con vs. Northwestern, UNLV, Wyoming, Jacksonville State
2003 Bowl: Lost to NC State
2004: 4-7 (2-6), Non-con vs. Tulsa, Toledo, Northwestern
2005: 6-5 (3-5), Non-con vs. Florida Atlantic, Appalachian State, Louisiana Tech
2005 Bowl: Win vs. Houston
2006: 6-6 (3-5), Non-con vs. Northwestern State, LA Monroe, Toledo, South Florida
2007: 11-1 (7-1), Non-con vs. Central Michigan, SE LA, Toledo, Florida International
2007 Bowl: Win vs. Virginia Tech
2008: 7-5 (4-4), Non-con vs. Florida International, LA Tech, South Florida, Sam Houston State
2008 Bowl: Win vs. Minnesota
2009: 5-5 (1-5), Non-con vs. Northern Colorado, UTEP, Duke, Southern Miss
Looking PURELY at stats, Mangino has bought his wins. A conference record of 23-39 while playing a total of 5 opponents from BCS conference in the non-con season: Northwestern (twice), South Florida (twice), Duke.
I believe we went 1-1 against NW, and 1-1 against South Florida.
25 of Mangino’s 50 total victories came against non-BCS conference opponents, despite the fact that we play twice as many games in conference than out of conference, and (as mentioned in the quote) 5 BCS teams out of conference.
We have had exactly one win, IMO, against an “elite” opponent (VaTech in the Orange Bowl). We’ve ended the year ranked once. We have non-winning records against every team in the Big 12, except for Mizzou (awesome!) and Iowa State (meh.).
Is this poster correct? Is most of Mangino’s reputation staked on simply winning games that we were supposed to (up until this year)?
And if that is true, how much rope does he really deserve for some of these comments he has made? Whether you support his motivational methods or not, how effective can we say they’ve really been? Is it possible that some of our recent success has come in spite of, not because of, Mark Mangino?
RODD TEESING, my arch-nemesis! Give us back our TODD, you rapscallion!
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Nov 20, 2009 8:11 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
that's pretty accurate...
at the same time, that’s the blueprint Bill Snyder laid out for building a program from nothing. Difference was, once Snyder built it…he kept winning.
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
Went 0-2 against NW if I'm not mistaken, lost two close games
And yeah 1-1 vs. South Florida. The only non Big12 win we’ve had of note is VTech obviously, after that it is probably Tulsa/South Florida/ Toledo 2005-2006 years based on how those teams finished. Or Smacking Central Michigan.
Our best Big12 win has to be Missouri last year.
I posted the schedule in the article I posted about firing Mangino to kind of show what you’re saying, apart from 2007 its been pretty tough sledding. Before the comments I still thought he deserved more time, now that the comments and actions surfaced, a little more inclined to bring up the stats.
by Andrew Clark on Nov 20, 2009 9:10 PM CST up reply actions
I thought the bowl blowout of
Minnesota was a good win. They weren’t a great team but still a BCS team from a good football conference
by I need more Esteban on Nov 21, 2009 1:35 PM CST up reply actions
That was solid
Although that same Sota team lost 55-0 to Iowa last year. Pretty inconsistent, made a bowl beating up on the crappier big10 teams of that season. Still a nice win though. Beating Mizzou and then running train on Minny was probably the best two game stretch our program has had for back to back wins.
by Andrew Clark on Nov 21, 2009 3:18 PM CST up reply actions
Article on CBSSports
Dennis Dodd wrote this article that I think sums it up well.
Right or wrong, former players have essentially chopped the legs out from underneath Mangino, who cannot return as coach. Recruiting is shot. So is the coach’s credibility. He might never be a head coach again. Still, all we have is a poke in the chest during a friggin’ walk-through for gosh sakes. That, and some inappropriate language.
You want to tear down a program and a man for that?
We’re damned if we do, damned if we don’t. We should fire him because recruiting has been damaged. We shouldn’t fire him for what is now seeming like some insignificant events.
Insanity is just a state of mind.
"Program"
Here’s the thing… while what he has done in the past might not be THAT bad (although the comments about alcoholic fathers and brothers that just got shot are despicable, IMO), he hasn’t been THAT successful, either.
The man keeps a mental rolodex on everything bad that has happened to his players so he can pull it out and insult them when he feels like it. That’s the sign of a grade-A a-hole in my book. While we can sit here and debate whether or not a-hole tactics should work, or if we’ve become too “soft” and a bunch of “pussies” in modern times, I think that debate misses the point.
The question shouldn’t be, “can/should Mangino’s tactics work?” The question should be, "have Mangino’s tactics worked well enough to put up with the negatives?
In other words, how much of a program would we really be tearing down?
RODD TEESING, my arch-nemesis! Give us back our TODD, you rapscallion!
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Nov 20, 2009 8:36 PM CST up reply actions
Good question
Would we set ourselves back to Mangino’s first days, or could someone pick up where he left off?
Which brings us to the coach question: who will replace him?
And now we hear KU fans dropping names like Tommy Tuberville, Brent Venables and Gary Patterson as replacements? What coach is going to want to come to a place where you could win 12 one year and have an anonymous mutiny behind your back two years later?
Insanity is just a state of mind.
this program is way better off then when he got here...
the job is significantly more attractive and the right hire can continue the momentum. Some will argue that we’ve been here before with Mason and it took us forever to recover. The difference is Mason left because he wasn’t supported and it was a crappy job. No $$$ going to football period. That isn’t the case anymore. I’m not saying we are assured success, hell we might end up back in the crapper…but it won’t be for the same reasons in the past.
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
mmhhmm
some of these upper-eschilon names being thrown around are just ridiculous. lawrence is not nor has it ever been a great place to caoch football. I don’t know where ku will go but it is certainely not going to lead to patterson, venables, tuberville, or kelly. And if it were to, be VERY grateful for what you would have.
"The field mouse is fast but the owl sees at night"- Ricky Bobby's belligerent Granddaddy
Tubs would be the only name of those that might give it a second look.
And that’s a long shot.
I used to work with an old man that told me. Son, every workplace has a dumbass, if you don't have one where you work, then I'm afraid you're it.
I'd agree that some of the names are a little ridiculous...
but there’s no denying it’s a better job than in 2001 when we got coach Mangino who at the time was a pretty hot coordinator.
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
Agree with Denver
Mangino was the top assistant on a national title team. Now Mangino is the 15th highest paid coach in America (or something close to that) we have brand new facilities, people actually go to games now/care more, etc. Throw in a few past recruiting classes that have been pretty solid including the last which is tops in the North (barring some huge defections which may happen) and playing in the big12 north every year (which gives you a shot to win it every year. This year is a prime example of it). I dunno. I don’t think its the worse job ever. Could be one that someone hungry for a second shake at things at a BCS program (Tuberville) an up and coming coordinator or a successful small-team coach might wanna take a shot at. Patterson would be stupid to leave TCU IMO, same with Johnson at Boise State, those programs are too built and they have a shot at a BCS bowl every season considering their conference and talent advantage, but I’m sure we can find someone decent.
by Andrew Clark on Nov 20, 2009 9:28 PM CST up reply actions
Yeah I pitched Tuberville when I brought up this subject before the allegations
Which seems crazy now that the whole thing blew up a day after my post. Weirdo…
by Andrew Clark on Nov 20, 2009 9:23 PM CST up reply actions
too bad Todd won't be around if it's Turner...
Someone could teach him how the option’s supposed to work.
Would it be smart for Nebraska to hire someone like Jerrod Haase to coach basketball?
RODD TEESING, my arch-nemesis! Give us back our TODD, you rapscallion!
by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Nov 21, 2009 12:20 PM CST up reply actions
no way...
clearly CB McGrath is the right choice : )
Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.
I always though Jerod was sort of an errand boy-tool for Roy.
His favorite move was to dive after a ball that the opposition had knocked out of bounds and get a hand on it so it was basically a turnover, but it looked great as he crashed into the stands and Max & Bob would have orgasms as they shrieked about his hustle. When Roy had 4 1st round NBA picks on the court they’d pass the ball around until it got to Haase, and he would hog the ball until the shot clock ran down and make a flailing tasmanian devil drive towards the basket. Not my favorite player.
That being said, if he could recruit like Matt Doherty he could make a go of it. They don’t have much to lose.
by hunter s. royal on Nov 21, 2009 1:30 PM CST up reply actions
How cute!
Charlie Weis is holding hands with his players as they enter the field. Let’s pull out some more emotional schtick to try and save your job.
My respect for him is boundless.
by hunter s. royal on Nov 21, 2009 1:37 PM CST reply actions
He is holding hands with them
To get the momentum to make it to the sideline. Old frontbutt can’t make that trip alone.
by Andrew Clark on Nov 21, 2009 3:19 PM CST up reply actions
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