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Why do Jayhawks hate Tarheels?

My wife is a Tarheel.  Her family is a bunch of Tarheels.  My uncle and his family are freaking Tarheels.  They are sensible people who despite their allegiance seem to live respectable lives.  But why do I have this gnawing deep hatred for their team that keeps me from fully accepting these people as family?  What is it about the Tarheels that I hate so much?

Star-divide

I'm not sure when or why really, I developed such animosity towards Chapel Hill.  I had a tendency as a kid (I think many of us did) to arbitrarily dislike certain things.  Some of those things have stuck with me, my hatred for all things Tarheel is one of them.  The older I get, I can really start to flesh out my hate and legitimize it. 

I remember coming to the East Coast for the first time when I was just another Kansas kid in Junior High for some choir thing and I ran into a bunch of North Carolinians.  This was right around when Coach Smith finally starting winning championships.  There was a smugness there.  They really thought they were better than me because they were North Carolina fans.  All this despite KU's championship in 1988 and final four runs in '91 and '93 were still fresh.  It seemed that between them and Duke if you weren't a North Carolinian you just were not a worth human being.  (I still remember Laetner stepping on a Kentucky player's head just minutes before making the shot of the decade.  Man I hated that guy)

As we all know, KU and UNC are intertwined with our histories often working in parallel.  Strange that we've only met 9 times on the court in the more than 200 combined years of the programs.  It is strange that a team that we play so infrequently can feel like such a bitter rival.  Perhaps more telling is that 4 of those meetings have been in the season's final weekend.  KU and UNC have met more times in the Final Four than any other two teams.  Maybe the ghosts of 1957 haunt me somehow. 

Yet, despite our similar histories, accomplishments, and overall contributions to the great game of college basketball; Kansas is somehow overshadowed by North Carolina.  Above all things, beyond the coach stealing, beyond the smugness, beyond Coach Smith's titanic ego, it is this that bothers me the most.  It is the notion that because Kansas isn't North Carolina it isn't an elite program.  My uncle, who was a long-time campus pastor at UNC, regards KU as a second-tier team.  In his words, "a Michigan State" (ironically enough given Saturday's game).  I, of course, bristled and sent a long e-mail detailing our accomplishments.  I'll post it here if I can dig it up - it's pretty good.  The thing is, he's not alone.  There's a whole sports-going public that seems to make the same realization. 

Is it the East Coast bias?  The Dickie V machine? I don't know.  All I know is I hate it.  And I hate UNC.

 

 

Poll
As Kansas Basketball fans who do we love to hate the most?
Mizzou
18 votes
K-State
1 votes
Texas
1 votes
Oklahoma
0 votes
North Carolina
8 votes
Duke
4 votes

32 votes | Poll has closed

2 recs | Comment 34 comments

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Comments

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Strong work for the first go...enjoyed it and rec'd...

I voted for Duke and I did it on gut reaction. I suppose my hatred for UNC truly began with the coach stealing incident of 2003. Prior to that I sort of looked at them as a friendly program. They had a KU alum as a coach he had been successful, we got one of their own to coach us and he had been successful. All in all not a lot of animosity from me other than the stories of the 57’ title game.

After the Roy departure it was game on…their ego’s had been inappropriately boosted and the east coast machine was in full effect. Now labadabba, you being stuck out east and clearly surrounded by so many Tar Holes in your life I can understand the feeling, but for me last year really felt good…exercised the demons if you will and I can renew my stronger hatred for Duke, probably Missouri 2nd and K-State 3rd (although w/only 1year of respectable ball I’m not sure they’re worth the time)

My take on OU and Texas is this…good fans, love their football, worthy opponents in basketball and for that I am grateful. Throughout the Roy Williams years we cruised through the conference slate with little challenge and I think it really had a negative impact on our tourney performances. With a stronger conference, one we have won 4 consecutive years I might add, we claimed the ultimate prize.

To the original point though, yes there are a lot of reasons KU fans could hate UNC but after last year, I for one am content letting the world think what they want. I’d rather be amongst friends and watch the defending National Champion Jayhawks with those who appreciate them.

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.

by Denverjhawk on Jan 7, 2009 2:37 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

+1

I always kind of liked UNC before Roy went there. Duke was the team I really hated. Now, when the Blue Devils and Heels go at it, I’m always cheering for Duke. Kind of weird.

by I need more Esteban on Jan 7, 2009 7:19 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I too have for the first time in recent years...

found myself cheering for Duke, but only when they play UNC

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.

by Denverjhawk on Jan 7, 2009 7:20 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

My uncle

even propagandized my Grandmother into rooting for UNC against KU. She had completely forgotten I am a KU alumnus. It should be noted, nobody on my side of the family ever attended UNC. Yet somehow, my little old gramma from Iowa just a few hours away from dear old Lawrence chose the Carolina half of the family rather than the Kansas. Freaking weak. Now I’m pissed off all over again…

by labbadabba on Jan 7, 2009 2:38 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Wow...

I wouldn’t have been able to speak to them…I’m fortunate in that I’m a 3rd Gen Jayhawk and the majority of my family are Jayhawks…

Now I did grow up in Illinois just north of St. Louis so I think that is where my absolute hatred for Missouri comes from. Ever since I left for Lawrence and school, my sports watching days have been fairly “jackass” free, if you will. No serious opponents in my face spouting ridiculousness.

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.

by Denverjhawk on Jan 7, 2009 2:41 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He's

a good guy. Its just all he knows. And its tough to be mad at your gramma for any length of time. I’m the only Jayhawk alumnus in my immediate family but we’re all pretty ardent fans. I just don’t know what’s going to happen with my kids (should THAT ever happen). The wife seems to think that the kids will get the best education possible at Carolina. My line of work won’t really be taking back to Kansas anytime soon, so I have to figure out how to turn my unborn children into Jayhawks before its too late

by labbadabba on Jan 7, 2009 2:47 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You're right...

can’t be mad at grandma…and I’ve been plotting my unborn children’s Jayhawk fandom for years….it’s really not an option…and I will be instituting a rule that I will never pay a tuition for a school that spells Missouri…Mizzou…

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.

by Denverjhawk on Jan 7, 2009 2:50 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Speaking of Vitale...

I’m guessing we might get a Mario Chalmers love fest tonight, Vitale is doing the Denver vs. Miami NBA game as part of an ESPN promo…on the other hand he might go on and on about Dwayne Wade, Michael Beasley and any number of others.

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.

by Denverjhawk on Jan 7, 2009 2:44 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

yeah -

I saw a promo for that. It might actually get me to watch an NBA game…

by labbadabba on Jan 7, 2009 2:48 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I might have to head down there to see it myself

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.

by Denverjhawk on Jan 7, 2009 2:49 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

One thing we can agree on

I hate North Carolina, too. Although the object of my animosity is Tyler Hansbrough and the media hype machine that turned him into the “player of the year” last season, rather than Roy Williams and Dean Smith. Well, on second thought, I can’t stand Roy Williams, either. Golly-gee-whiz-I-don’t-give-a-shit-about-North-Carolina…phoniest bastard in college basketball.

We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats

by TB on Jan 7, 2009 4:24 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Tyler Hansbrough media hype machine...?

whatever are you talking about?

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.

by Denverjhawk on Jan 7, 2009 4:33 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think he means the whole “Psycho-T” deal. So dumb.

Insanity is just a state of mind.

by giants9107 on Jan 7, 2009 5:23 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I know...

I was being sarcastic…the Psycho-T campaign was the worst case of having something shoved down my throat that I’ve ever experienced.

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.

by Denverjhawk on Jan 7, 2009 5:27 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think if Mizzou started challenging

us again year in and year out then this poll would be different, it’s kind of a “what have you done for me lately” kind of thing.

by I need more Esteban on Jan 7, 2009 7:21 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

absolutely...

if this were an all sports poll, I vote Missouri hands down…However this is basketball related and since Kareem and Gilbert departed Mizzou basketball has been a cluster and because of that it’s far to easy to disregard their existence at this point. Looks like things might be changing though.

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.

by Denverjhawk on Jan 7, 2009 7:23 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

My Reasons

I think my hatred of UNC comes down to three things:

1. Smugness of fans. Covered pretty well already. One thing to think about: considering the rediculous amount of talent they’ve throughout the years, they’ve only won two titles since Jordan. This relates to my second point:

2. Overhype. Why don’t more members of the media mention the fact that Roy Williams has never won a national championship with his own players? Why doesn’t he get the crap that “offense only” coaches in every other sport do? Why does everyone gloss over the fact that Tyler Hansbrough is basically useless when you put a decent big man on him?

3. Finally, Roy Williams’ refusal to get into recruiting contests with UNC over the years always pissed me off. Just think about how much pain could’ve been avoided/ joy could’ve been experienced with the right players from the more populous half the country. Was his relationship with Dean really so fragile that it couldn’t have handled a little competition for players like Vince Carter?

by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Jan 7, 2009 8:31 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

yeah that was BS

He wouldn’t recruit an entire coast because of his BS love for North Carolina. Bill Self will go anywhere, anytime to get a player. Roy probably really hurt us at times because of this. Think of all the really crappy classes that Roy had that made rebuilding a lot tougher.

by I need more Esteban on Jan 7, 2009 8:36 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Bill Self definitely blew that myth...

Roy used to love blaming his inability to recruit the East on Kansas being “in the middle of nowhere”

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.

by Denverjhawk on Jan 7, 2009 8:59 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Can't have coaches like that

That’s why we love Frank Martin and Dalonte Hill. They don’t complain about how hard it is to recruit to Manhattan, Kan. They just go out and convince good players to come play for them. Oddly, many of them from the East Coast.

We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats

by TB on Jan 8, 2009 7:59 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

They both have a fair amound of connections out east, correct??

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.

by Denverjhawk on Jan 8, 2009 8:09 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yeah

Hill in Washington, D.C., Martin in Florida.

We'll carry the banner high!
Bring On The Cats

by TB on Jan 8, 2009 11:32 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Excellent post.

I always despised Duke the most until Roy left. I still vividly remember playing Duke in 86 with Larry Brown’s best team and losing out because of the pathetic flopping by the Dukies. I always thought the most cowardly and unsportsmanlike act in college b-ball was to fake a charging foul, which is 98% of Krzyzewski’s coaching method. Plus, if it’s done well by good athletes, it’s almost impossible for the refs to fairly officiate a game. To man up and take a charge is a great play in college ball, but when it’s faked it’s reprehensible. When Roy left I merely began to hate them both, though the win last year burned off most of the venom towards Carolina.(On a related note, there’s a great book about the rivalry between Duke-Carolina called “To Hate Like This is to be Happy Forever” by Will Blythe. It details the enmity between the programs very well. Plus a great cover photo of Coach K morphing into a rat.)

by hunter s. royal on Jan 7, 2009 10:19 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Mizzou taking a lead...

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.

by Denverjhawk on Jan 7, 2009 11:20 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I figured they would

but that is why I made the poll a basketball only poll. I wanted to see how much is a carry-over from the KU/Mizzou rivalry and how much comes from more worthy basketball rivals.

by labbadabba on Jan 7, 2009 11:28 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

This may be their peak.

A crucial year for Anderson. If they can’t compete for the North title this year with the losses by KU & K-state he’s done for. Losing Keon Lawrence was a big negative, considering Lyons and Carroll will be gone after this year.

by hunter s. royal on Jan 7, 2009 11:29 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

They lose a lot after this year for sure...

if they can’t build some momentum, your right could be the beginning of the end…again…not that they care, everytime you mention that we won the title last year their fans are very good at pointing out how little basketball means to them.

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.

by Denverjhawk on Jan 7, 2009 11:31 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Maybe they'll pull a K-State-Snyder move & bring back Norm Stewart.

Of course we won’t have to yell sit down Norm anymore. He’ll have to use a scooter to get around the sidelines.

by hunter s. royal on Jan 7, 2009 11:37 PM CST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Ever since Norm retired...

and they’ve had Snyder and now Anderson, I gained a new appreciation for Norm and in my mind he was a “worth f’n adversary”…anyone who can spot the movie quote reference gets a bonus point.

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.

by Denverjhawk on Jan 8, 2009 7:25 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Sounds like

a Jay and Silent Bob quote…

by labbadabba on Jan 8, 2009 9:47 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

nope...

also realized I missed a y…it should read…

worthy f’n adversary…

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.

by Denverjhawk on Jan 8, 2009 9:51 AM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Lebowski

Me and Charlie…eyeball to eyeball. That’s f’n combat.

Who’s wearing black pajamas, Walter?

To bring it back to the topic, it’s absurd that Norm Stewart was one of the first people elected to the College Basketball Hall of Fame. Is this thing serious about honoring the history of the sport, or does it just want to maximize its local tourist receipts?

by KennyGregoryRockThaCradle on Jan 8, 2009 2:46 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

ding ding ding....

we have a winner…

Some people are like Slinkies...not really good for anything but they make you smile when pushed down the stairs.

by Denverjhawk on Jan 8, 2009 2:49 PM CST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

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